Results 1 to 9 of 9

Thread: WTM numeral search issue

  1. #1
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Posts
    308

    Default WTM numeral search issue

    I've encountered the following issue when attempting to search on numerals in the WTM:

    1. When accent-sensitive searching is enabled, a search for *@u* results in nothing being retreived. Further, WTM lists numerals in the browse window as @a, eg רביעי in Gen 1:19 is listed as y[iybir>@amsa+SxxxExHxNxZ9Rx.

    2. When accent-sensitive searching is disabled, a search for *@u* results in a successful retrieval of numerals. Further, WTM now lists numerals in the browse windows as @u, eg רביעי in Gen 1:19 is listed as y[iybir>@uomsa+SxxxExHxNxRx.

    I'm wondering if others have the same issue? Or if I'm doing something wrong?

    Thanks,
    David Kummerow.

  2. #2

    Default Not happening here

    Hi, David,

    With vowel-sensitive + accent-sensitive searching, I get all the correct hits.
    With vowel-sensitive only, all the correct hits.
    With accent-sensitive only (vowel OFF), I get an error message that the search item .*@u* doesn't exist. Not sure why.

  3. #3
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Posts
    308

    Default

    Hi Philip,

    Thanks for testing. I hadn't checked the correlation with vowel-sensitive searching, and my results are the same as yours. To correct what I wrote above:

    1. When accent-sensitive searching is enabled along with vowel-sensitive searching disabled, a search for *@u* results in nothing being retreived. Further, WTM lists numerals in the browse window as @a, eg רביעי in Gen 1:19 is listed as y[iybir>@amsa+SxxxExHxNxZ9Rx.

    2. When accent-sensitive searching is disabled when vowel-sensitive searching is also disabled, a search for *@u* results in a successful retrieval of numerals. Further, WTM now lists numerals in the browse windows as @u, eg רביעי in Gen 1:19 is listed as y[iybir>@uomsa+SxxxExHxNxRx.

    Is this what you get too?

    Thanks,
    David.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Posts
    308

    Default

    I've encountered further issues relating to combinations of vowel-sensitive and accent-sensitive searching:

    1. If accent-sensitive searching is enabled and vowel-sensitive searching is enabled, when hovering over a word in WTT or WTM accent information is displayed, eg the first two words of Gen 1:1:

    בְּ particle preposition רֵאשִׁית noun common feminine singular absolute accent:Tipha, Majela, or Tarha

    ברא verb qal perfect 3rd person masculine singular homonym 1 accent:Munah

    2. However, if accent-sensitive searching is enabled and vowel-sensitive searching is disabled, when hovering over verbs accent information is not displayed but for non-verbs it still is displayed (HALOT data on verbs is also lost), eg the first two words of Gen 1:1:

    בְּ particle preposition רֵאשִׁית noun common feminine singular absolute accent:Tipha, Majela, or Tarha

    ברא verb qal perfect 3rd person masculine singular


    What might I be doing wrong to cause inconsistent retrieval of data? Is anyone else able to reproduce the above?

    Thanks,
    David.

  5. #5

    Default My theory

    Hi, David,

    I suspect that this is a programming issue. Since no masoretic texts exist, that I know of, without vowel-pointing but with accents, the programmer's assumption was that if a person was concerned about the accents, they would also be concerned about the vowel points.

    Perhaps linking the two toggles so that anytime accent sensitive searching is turned on, vowel-point sensitive searching would also be turned on might make that connection explicit and more transparent.

    What do you think?

  6. #6
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Posts
    308

    Default

    Yes, I think that would be a good idea. I few things are quite stange though, especially the fact that non-verbs still display the correct data and that depending on what is checked numerals appear tagged as either @u or @a.

    Regards,
    David.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Posts
    1,081

    Default Numeral search problem

    Hi David and Philip,
    This is now fixed and I posted a new Hebrew database update to take care of it. There are actually 4 separate Hebrew databases corresponding to the four combinations of accents on and off and vowels on and off. The accents only on combination was being built from an earlier edition fo the WTM database, before they added the numeral tags apparently. I guess few people search on accents with volwel point sensitivity turned off. Otherwise this would have been caught.
    God bless,
    Mike

  8. #8
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Posts
    308

    Default

    Hi Mike,

    Many thanks for the fix! I can confirm that accent and HALOT display on verbs as mentioned above is repaired. A weird glitch is still happening with adjectives. I'll explain the steps with some screen shots:

    Step 1. Start with Gen 1:19 with both accent- and vowel-sensitive search disabled. Numerals are tagged with u.




    Step 2. Enable vowel-sensitive search and accent-searching -- in that order. Numerals are tagged with u.




    Step 3. Disable vowel-sensitive searching, leaving accent-sensitive search enabled. Numerals are tagged with u.




    Step 4. Back to start, with vowel-sensitive and accent-sensitive search disabled. See image from step 1 (I couldn't repost it as it seems posts are limited to four images only).


    Step 5. Now enable accent-sensitive searching only. Adjectives are not tagged with u but with a.




    Thanks for looking into this.

    Thanks,
    David.

  9. #9
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Posts
    308

    Default

    Issue fixed as of the latest update posted today.

    Thanks,
    david.

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •