What would you like to see in BibleWorks 10?

I completely agree with this suggestion, which was already made in the 7th post in this thread.

This brings me to wonder whether this thread, which has been going on for almost a month, has perhaps now completely served its purpose and should be closed. The two most recent suggestions have both been about items that were already requested earlier in the thread, which is getting to be too long to wade through.

Long as it is, let me humbly request that, at a minimum, those who wish to add items to this list of suggestions first go through the thread and see whether their suggestion has already been made.

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Originally Posted by DavidR

I completely agree with this suggestion, which was already made in the 7th post in this thread.

This brings me to wonder whether this thread, which has been going on for almost a month, has perhaps now completely served its purpose and should be closed. The two most recent suggestions have both been about items that were already requested earlier in the thread, which is getting to be too long to wade through.

Long as it is, let me humbly request that, at a minimum, those who wish to add items to this list of suggestions first go through the thread and see whether their suggestion has already been made.

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I don't know . . . I think some people are posting to "second" and "third" requests that have already been made. I would imagine that the more people are interested in an addition, the more likely that BW would add it.

Muraoka's Greek English Lexicon to the Septuagint would be a great add on. Some electronic version of his A Greek-Hebrew/Aramaic Two-way Index to the Septuagint would be a great addition to the Tov-Polak parallel MT/LXX, given that the index includes different recensions as well as apocryphal lit. I think that an index like this would not be redundant if it could be used to expand the search features of BibleWorks. (Imagine a cross-linguistic search feature where one could click a Greek word and then be lead to a search of all Hebrew and Aramaic reflexes in the OT and Qumran.)

I also think that Danker's Concise Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament would be a worthy addition (as mentioned already). Preferably it would be in the base package (like "Baby Bauer" is now). David J.A. Clines' Concise Dictionary of Classical Hebrew would be a worthy add-on in that it would cover Qumran Hebrew as well as biblical Hebrew. Of course his multi-volume, super-expensive Dictionary of Classical Hebrew would be a real plus.

An expansion of the functionality of the Related Verses Tool and Phrase Matching Tool to allow for cross-version and mulitple verse comparisons would be helpful. I'd love to see a souped up version of this that would be similar to Accordance's INFER command. This would allow for searches for allusions and quotations across corpora. Right now it can be done on a verse by verse basis, but it would be extremely helpful to be able to compare Isaiah 53 to the whole New Testament or Ezekiel with Revelation, or James with Sirach, etc.

One thing that would be great would be some way of setting up an über-index of allusions and intertextual connections that could cross corpora. An xrefs file that could work with biblical texts, Apostolic Fathers, Josephus, Philo, Pseudepigrapha, or any other corpus of material would be extremely helpful. The index could work with references within BW, but it could also point to references outside of BibleWorks (e.g. Talmud, Mishnah, Midrash, etc.). What would REALLY be interesting here would be some means of making this a 'community built' list of allusions where folks could 'vote' on connections in the index or submit new connections if they think they might be there.

A way of expanding the syntax of the External Links Manager would be helpful (for instance, being able to have some kind of array that would convert different characters [like what represents an accent mark, etc.] would be helpful for going from bwgrkl to CCAT for Perseus searches, etc., as would the ability to send Unicode Greek to the web). It would also be helpful to have some means of converting syntax regarding book, chapter or verse number to different sites. So that if Gen 1:1 is represented somewhere as 001.01.01 the ELM could handle it.

Finally I'd love to see the ability to create one's own lexicon. Currently we can create versions, we can create CHM modules, we can even tag CHM modules to work verse-by-verse in the Verse Tab, but it would amazing if we could crunch our own lexicons as well.

Second that. Especially Muraoka's Greek English Lexicon to the Septuagint (2010: though very pricey, I'm afraid) which would be more than welcome (as an add-on or whatever), as would (and has this been mentioned before?) NETS: The New English Translation of the Septuagint.:p

Another suggestion: I would like to see the Leedy diagrams turned into a tab as well. I am really growing fund of the BW9-interface with its flexibility of dragging tabs around the two Analysis-windows. And I should like to see as much as possible turned into tabs so you can have it open permanently when browsing texts.

Morten

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Originally Posted by basilides

Second that. Especially Muraoka's Greek English Lexicon to the Septuagint (2010: though very pricey, I'm afraid) which would be more than welcome (as an add-on or whatever), as would (and has this been mentioned before?) NETS: The New English Translation of the Septuagint.:p

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Well, seeing as the Aramaic Peshitta New Testament Database (APNT) is sold as a module maybe something could be worked out for the NETS, too.

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Originally Posted by bkMitchell

Well, seeing as the Aramaic Peshitta New Testament Database (APNT) is sold as a module maybe something could be worked out for the NETS, too.

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Many BibleWorkers hope so. Then finally we can stop begging Mike B. to provide us with something BibleWorks should have offered years ago (i.e., THE NEW ENGLISH TRANSLATION OF THE SEPTUAGINT), among several other resources mentioned in this thread related to the LXX.

One thing I would like to see in the next version of BibleWorks is a way of listing different forms automatically.

I'm doing a little looking right now on second aorist forms (is this the right way of saying it in English?). Take for example ἔρχομαι, 3d pers., plur.:

*ἦλθον: 444x
*ήλθοσαν: 17x
*ῆλθαν: 9x


As far as I know, there is no way of making BW spit out an automatic list like this (much less conduct a search for specific endings via a morphological search, i.e., in BGM rather than BGT). Lists of this kind can be useful for teaching and research, and it seems to me like an area that is not very developed in BW. Perhaps others might have come across this. I'd be interested in your feedback (and other examples!).

Actually the Usage Summary for BGM approaches this, but there seems to be no way of sorting out the data in it, or exporting it to a word processor. It's also limited to Biblical texts, if I'm not mistaken.

Don Cobb
Aix-en-Povence, France

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Originally Posted by basilides

Second that. Especially Muraoka's Greek English Lexicon to the Septuagint (2010: though very pricey, I'm afraid) which would be more than welcome (as an add-on or whatever), as would (and has this been mentioned before?) NETS: The New English Translation of the Septuagint.:p

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It was mentioned just 6 posts previously to yours. That's what I mean about checking the thread before posting a suggestion. And about the thread having perhaps outlived its usefulness, since it's gotten too long for people to want to take time looking through it.

I am well aware of that. Isn't that obvious. I was the one who keeps mentioning it, in the hope that the squeaky wheel will get the grease (hence the red in bold). Good grief!

Sorry, no offense meant. It was someone else who'd mentioned it in post #78. It's too bad this forum doesn't allow for polls (does it?), which would allow voting rather than multiple posting to make it clear how much a resource is desired.

I thing to consider: A root search-feature.
It is possible in Accordance, and I would like to use a feature like this from time to time. Like, when searching on everything that has to do with disciples and discipleship in Matthew - then you have to know that at least three words are in play (mathetes, manthano, matheteuo). A root search would in principal help you clarify certain topics better.

On the other hand, such a feature must be based on manual tagging and thus after all introduce a number of editorial decisions.

What do you think? Have you ever missed a root-search function?

Morten

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Originally Posted by MortenJensen

What do you think? Have you ever missed a root-search function?
Morten

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Yeah... See my blog post.

Thanks, then we are two of us. Should not be that difficult to implement, I guess.
I liked your post on LN-domains. The problem with these searches, though, is that they tend to be to wide-ranged. Try searching for mathethes in Matt, and you will get a whole lot other stuff as well.
Morten

I can see the usefulness of this, but I can see pitfalls as well, even if it were easy to implement. I fear it would tempt early-stage students in particular (and maybe some more experienced people as well) into the etymological fallacy. For instance, the fact that both παραθήκη and διαθήκη come from the root found in τίθημι is almost meaningless, since both the root and Greek prepositions are so wide-ranging in the derivatives that they can form. Yet given a powerful enough root search feature, I guarantee you that inside of a week you'd have people preaching sermons in which the "good deposit" of 2 Tim. 1:14 was getting linked to a theology of covenant on no viable linguistic grounds whatsoever.

Maybe a root-search feature ought to come with a warning label and a reference to James Barr's The Semantics of Biblical Language!

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Originally Posted by DavidR

Maybe a root-search feature ought to come with a warning label and a reference to James Barr's The Semantics of Biblical Language!

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You could say that about ALL BIBLE SOFTWARE TOOLS IN GENERAL!!! :) Uncle Ben's advice to Spidey applies to any such tool: "With great power comes great responsibility."

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Originally Posted by jdarlack

You could say that about ALL BIBLE SOFTWARE TOOLS IN GENERAL!!! :) Uncle Ben's advice to Spidey applies to any such tool: "With great power comes great responsibility."

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Yes, absolutely. That's the advantage of studying languages and exegesis in a seminary or other educational context. The wonderful ability to learn these things independently that's available today has the downside of providing less context and less mentoring for the learner.

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Originally Posted by MortenJensen

I thing to consider: A root search-feature.
It is possible in Accordance, and I would like to use a feature like this from time to time. Like, when searching on everything that has to do with disciples and discipleship in Matthew - then you have to know that at least three words are in play (mathetes, manthano, matheteuo). A root search would in principal help you clarify certain topics better.

On the other hand, such a feature must be based on manual tagging and thus after all introduce a number of editorial decisions.

What do you think? Have you ever missed a root-search function?

Morten

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It would be helpful, at times, but couldn't you do the same thing by using the Graphical Search Engine? It would take a little longer, as you would have to set up the search parameters yourself, but it could easily be done.

I don't think so. How will you do that?

Morten

Granted, this thread is getting long in the tooth, but what the heck!

This isn't already possible to do in BibleWorks 9.0, is it? If so, I haven't been paying attention.

It would be nice to have the ability to create (via, say, the VDC) an English interlinear to say the BGM or BNM in the Interlinear Mode (4 rows in columns), editable on the fly.

Please spare us the pedantic lectures on how interlinears stifle language learning. We lesser mortals sometimes need such crutches.

P.s.: I apologize for mentioning NETS (The New English Translation of the Septuagint) so often in this thread.;) It would make a nice BibleWorks 10.0 module, though. Emptor decernit.

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Originally Posted by MortenJensen

I thing to consider: A root search-feature.
It is possible in Accordance, and I would like to use a feature like this from time to time. Like, when searching on everything that has to do with disciples and discipleship in Matthew - then you have to know that at least three words are in play (mathetes, manthano, matheteuo). A root search would in principal help you clarify certain topics better.

On the other hand, such a feature must be based on manual tagging and thus after all introduce a number of editorial decisions.

What do you think? Have you ever missed a root-search function?

Morten

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Originally Posted by jimofbentley

It would be helpful, at times, but couldn't you do the same thing by using the Graphical Search Engine? It would take a little longer, as you would have to set up the search parameters yourself, but it could easily be done.

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Originally Posted by MortenJensen

I don't think so. How will you do that?

Morten

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I can set up the GSE, but I don't know how to display it here.

However, a simple "or" search:

/μαθητευω μανθανω καταμανθανω μαθητης μαθητρια συμμαθητης αμαθης

would turn up all of the roots having to do with "discipleship".

For this, I used Trenchard's Complete Vocabulary Guide to the Greek New Testament, under the "Cognate Word Groups" section.

I like most of what I see in the discussion, though I am not a manuscript expert.

1. I would like to see a more formal editor, with some of the ability that Word and Wperfect have to format.
2. Want to see Confessions set up like Bible Texts--Bold references (e.g WCF 1:3) along with a full set of 3 Forms of Unity
3. More clarity on what each tab does, and less confusion as to where to find the tabs I want.

BibleWorks Manuscript Project: How about a digitized septuagint to go with the New Testament? How about digitizing the Hebrew texts of the Old Testament as well?

interaction with wordsearch modules - keep this!

Awesome so far - would be untoucable with the above added to the manuscript project!

unicode for all modules !!

I would like BW10 to color highlight bracketed textual variants in the various Greek texts whenever I'm doing text comparisons. I've been building a variant database, and have missed numerous bracketed variants because they are not highlighted.

Unless, of course, there's some way to do it that I am missing (happens a lot with BW!).

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Originally Posted by bobvenem

I would like BW10 to color highlight bracketed textual variants in the various Greek texts whenever I'm doing text comparisons. I've been building a variant database, and have missed numerous bracketed variants because they are not highlighted.

Unless, of course, there's some way to do it that I am missing (happens a lot with BW!).

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This thread https://www.bibleworks.com/forums/sho...light=brackets discussed how to find the brackets.

I know of no automatic way to construct a colour file for all bracketed words/phrases in a given Greek version; it could be done manually by someone obsessive-compulsive enough.

I would suggest that making the bracketed text easily findable (and therefore high-lightable) in BW would be a very nice touch. In WTM information on textual notes is included in the morphological tags (and therefore searchable). Maybe something similar would be possible for Greek versions.

Thanks, Jim. I followed that thread a while back, and downloaded the GNT as an rtf file as suggested by Michael. However, I discovered that manually scanning the text in BW was faster for what I'm doing.

Here's hoping BW can add something to bring this feature on board.

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Originally Posted by Donald Cobb

One thing I would like to see in the next version of BibleWorks is a way of listing different forms automatically.

I'm doing a little looking right now on second aorist forms (is this the right way of saying it in English?). Take for example ἔρχομαι, 3d pers., plur.:

*ἦλθον: 444x
*ήλθοσαν: 17x
*ῆλθαν: 9x


As far as I know, there is no way of making BW spit out an automatic list like this (much less conduct a search for specific endings via a morphological search, i.e., in BGM rather than BGT). Lists of this kind can be useful for teaching and research, and it seems to me like an area that is not very developed in BW. Perhaps others might have come across this. I'd be interested in your feedback (and other examples!).

Actually the Usage Summary for BGM approaches this, but there seems to be no way of sorting out the data in it, or exporting it to a word processor. It's also limited to Biblical texts, if I'm not mistaken.

Don Cobb
Aix-en-Povence, France

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Hello all,

1. I made the above suggestion some time ago, but it was never picked up on. I'm thinking it's because it came between two posts on the NETS Bible (remember that?!!!). I'd be interested in knowing if any one else sees the usefulness of the idea.

One thing that strikes me is that the list-making capability in BW seems to be solely focused on verses, i.e., I can make a list of where certain verb or nouns are found, but it doesn't seem like I can compile a list of the forms themselves, that can then be sorted by frequency, etc. Another example : in one forum I follow, I found this:

Person/Number	Count
1P	870
1S	2069
2P	2059
2S	1416
3P	3322
3S	9426

I don't think this can be done in BW9. It would be a nice feature! Something like this can actually be done with the lemma/form usage statistics in the analysis pane, but I have yet to find a way of exporting the results.

2. Along the same lines, it would be nice to be able to compile, for instance, a list of aorist passive verbs that have a -θ ending (i.e., ἐλύθην, etc., as opposed to, say, Ao2 non sigmatic verbs, e.g., ἐσπάρην). This would require filtering and ordering both the data in the morphological versions, as well as the forms in the text versions. But it would be a nice feature!

3. It would also be nice to be able to export all this in some eye-pleasing format.

4. I read this morning the complaints registered about not being able to use unicode, and the responses given there. From what I understand, the non unicode internal language (if I'm not expressing myself too poorly) is one of the reasons for the speed in BW searches. There is one valid point in the remarks made, however, and that it that it's not currently possible to paste unicode texts into the search window in order to search on a root, a form or a string. In working with other resources, this would be a a helpful feature, IMO.

5. I would love to see a punctuated version of the LXX, Apostolic Fathers, and other Greek texts! It's not so difficult to get used to when actually reading the texts, but when doing string or (especially) syntax searches, there are often times when the punctuation affects the query.

6. It would also be nice to envision tie-ins with TLG and PHI texts. This would be really helpful in searching on forms outside of those texts that are in the BW9 version (same language searches).

7. A minor quibble. I know that aesthetics is a minor issue in the grand scheme. But it would be nice if the overall presentation of BW were improved. The button bar is already a step in the right direction. But one of my students looked at my setup a while ago (a non BW user) and quipped: "When will BW stop looking like a DOS program?" The Mac Beta version is even less appealing, visually. Along these same lines, harmonizing the different formats that are used would be nice. It seems like there is one for "Daily light", one for the CHM (?) documents (grammars, etc.), one for the brows window, one for the KWIK reports, etc. That gives the overall impression of an amateurish presentation.

I know this thread has gone on for quite a while, and perhaps I'm trying to flog a dead horse, but the suggestions here have been on my mind for a while. I also want to reiterate my thanks to the BW staff for the great--and selfless--work they do. I have a great appreciation for you folks!

Don Cobb
Aix-en-Provence, France

I would like to see Clines's Dictionary of Classical Hebrew & Muraoka's Greek-English Lexicon of the Septuagint in BW10.

I would be happy to see a better note taking system with an option to display note directory tree similar to something like this:

Attachment 1116

1) I would love to be able to type complex searches in the command line in Hebrew and Greek while using the Native Hebrew and Greek keyboards. In version 9 most of the Hebrew entry bugs were fixed but I am still unable to @* etc... while using a Hebrew keyboard. After entering the . or ' the Hebrew characters work, but the special code characters cannot be typed. This is a very old but that I hope will someday be come a priority to fix.

2) I would love to see an OT manuscript addition similar to the NT addition that came out in version 9.

3) I would love to see Hebrew versions of Jewish writings (like the Mishah) in the databases.

What about the ability of grouping Bible versions in the Browse Window? For example, one group would be the Original Languages, another one - English translations, still another one - Vernacular translations (Polish, Russian, German etc.). Then the group could either be expanded/collapsed with a click or one would pick a desired group from a dropdown menu. Might be quicker to navigate, rather than scrolling through dozens of translations. Thanks for considering.

I like that idea. And how about this as an expansion of it: hover the mouse pointer over a collapsed group, and the translations in that group appear in a popup window for a quick view of them.

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Originally Posted by doslidnyk

What about the ability of grouping Bible versions in the Browse Window? For example, one group would be the Original Languages, another one - English translations, still another one - Vernacular translations (Polish, Russian, German etc.). Then the group could either be expanded/collapsed with a click or one would pick a desired group from a dropdown menu. Might be quicker to navigate, rather than scrolling through dozens of translations. Thanks for considering.

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Some of us have been doing this very thing for years (BW8, if not BW7). Just use the tabs. One tab for your Greek NT versions, another for the Hebrew OT, another for English translations, and you have 9 more tabs for other combinations. In BW9 you can label the tabs, so you don't forget which is which. And if you should run out of tabs, you can always set up some "Favorites" in the BW Options Window, and you can switch between favorites in the same tab in just a couple clicks, and stay in the same Bible verse. Mark Eddy P.S. is anyone else having a problem using the "Enter" key to start a new paragraph here? I can't get it to work, as you can see from this post, which should be 3 separate paragraphs.

Things I would like to see improved in the presentation (some of these have already been mentioned by others):

- I can't comment on how BW9 looks in Windows 7 or 8, but in XP (especially under Parallels in Mac), the Greek font is very thin and not very enjoyable for reading. With the Mac Crossover version, it doesn't come across well either. Of the different fonts, bwgkl is the best, but it still could be improved. I would love to see a font that is better adapted for reading long passages. If it is acceptable as is in Windows 7 and 8, then at least a better font for Mac users would be appreciated!

- As I've already mentioned, with a reading mode that puts verses into paragraphs would be very appreciated. Along with that suggestion, I would suggest adding a space separating paragraphs as well. The current paragraph marker is helpful when working with texts, but not really when just reading.

- Again, when in browse mode, the text in BGT, etc. is very tight from one line to the next. If there were a way of setting it up (only in browse mode!) to make a larger line space, that would be helpful.

- In the verse list, I like the feature of being able to see the entire verse, and not just one line of it ("show entire verse"); however, there is currently no spacing between the references, so they look like they run together. It would nice to have each verse separated by a space.

All these comments are connected, I think, with the fact that other Bible programs (Logos, Accordance) have gotten on board with the idea that a Bible program is no longer just for researching words or verses; it's also for actual reading. BW is not geared toward that use, at least for the moment, but it would be helpful for it to do so!

BTW, I second DNS's suggestion of having an easier way of finding notes.

Don Cobb
Aix-en-Provence, France

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Originally Posted by Mark Eddy

Some of us have been doing this very thing for years (BW8, if not BW7). Just use the tabs. One tab for your Greek NT versions, another for the Hebrew OT, another for English translations, and you have 9 more tabs for other combinations. In BW9 you can label the tabs, so you don't forget which is which. And if you should run out of tabs, you can always set up some "Favorites" in the BW Options Window, and you can switch between favorites in the same tab in just a couple clicks, and stay in the same Bible verse.

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I do use tabs, for instance, when writing a sermon based on the week's lectionary texts, I have a tab for searching, and one tab each for the OT text, Psalm, Epistle, and Gospel. But in each of those tabs I have multiple versions in multiple languages (my most commonly used Favorite has NRS, NIV, WTT, BGT, VUL, PEH, not all of which, of course, appear in every context). Being able to have the English or other versions grouped so as to collapse and expand them would still be useful.

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Originally Posted by doslidnyk

What about the ability of grouping Bible versions in the Browse Window?

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I like this idea of grouping the the versions in the browse window.

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Originally Posted by Donald Cobb

Hello all,

One thing that strikes me is that the list-making capability in BW seems to be solely focused on verses, i.e., I can make a list of where certain verb or nouns are found, but it doesn't seem like I can compile a list of the forms themselves, that can then be sorted by frequency, etc. Don Cobb
Aix-en-Provence, France

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I would love to see more lexical statistics too. I posted something similar to this on 5/31/13 - https://www.bibleworks.com/forums/sho...rew-Stem-Stats

I want to count the number of times that a Hebrew verb is used in Qal, Niphal, Piel, Pual, etc. For instance, I'm looking at "aman" (to trust, believe) in Gen 15:6 - I want to see how many times that it's used in each stem.

Doing it manually yields -

Qal - 8x
Niph - 46x
Hiph - 51x

But this is me doing several different searches and recording the stats on my own - aman in qal; aman in niphal; aman in piel, etc. I'd much rather run one search and then be able to filter it as I'd like.

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Originally Posted by frankenfro

I would love to see more lexical statistics too. I posted something similar to this on 5/31/13 - https://www.bibleworks.com/forums/sho...rew-Stem-Stats

I want to count the number of times that a Hebrew verb is used in Qal, Niphal, Piel, Pual, etc. For instance, I'm looking at "aman" (to trust, believe) in Gen 15:6 - I want to see how many times that it's used in each stem.

Doing it manually yields -

Qal - 8x
Niph - 46x
Hiph - 51x

But this is me doing several different searches and recording the stats on my own - aman in qal; aman in niphal; aman in piel, etc. I'd much rather run one search and then be able to filter it as I'd like.

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If I understand your request, BibleWorks did satisfy it in BW8 and BW9. The thread you link to explains how to do it using the Word List Manager.
It took me a few minutes to figure out the required settings for the WLM, but then it is very easy to use.

1. Copy-paste Greek to Microsoft Word, using the Mcrosoft Symbol Font. Wouldn't matter if accents came through.

2. In at least one English version (KJV), one Hebrew, and one Greek, mark the Old Testament Quotations in the New Testament. Mark them in BOTH the Old and New Testaments. Only the part actually quoted, like "Out of Egypt I called my son" in Hosea 11. And make them either a link to each other, or else you hover over them and the "other end of the quotation" pops up. Absolutely the FIRST place everyone should start with "exegesis"! :rolleyes: