View Full Version : have logos, should i purchase bibleworks or SESB?

12-08-2004, 10:55 PM
I am writing this to hopefully get the opinion users of Bibleworks. I have Logos silver library, with many of the greek versions that bibleworks supplies. I am able to do the morphological searches etc... So i am curious what addition i would get if i purchased bibleworks 6. Also, if I already have Logos, would it make more sense to purchase the SESB or Bibleworks6? If those who already have both logos and bibleworks can also give their opinions of the similiarities and differences of both programs, I would greatly appreciate it.


12-09-2004, 12:16 AM
What is sesb?

12-09-2004, 12:32 AM
The SESB is the Stuttgart Electronic Study Bible.


Glenn Weaver
12-09-2004, 01:13 AM
Dear Alan,

Whether or not you should purchase BibleWorks really depends upon your study style and purposes. If you can do everything you need to do with what you already own, then there is little need to spend more money on more software.

I use Logos as a library program. It includes books that probably never will be in BibleWorks. As a library program it does a nice job.

But most of my work is in the Bible, especially in the original languages. For work in the original languages I don't know of anything that Logos does better than BibleWorks, and a lot of things that BibleWorks does that Logos users cannot do. Speed is an important issue for me as well. BW wins hands down on speed.

Concerning the SESB, the major draws for me are the critical apparati, but the price is too high for me to consider it. I have other tools that meet my needs in this area. Perhaps your situation is different.

BibleWorks does offer a money-back guarantee. If you don't like it, they will give you a refund. I doubt that you will be disappointed, though.


12-09-2004, 08:13 AM
Actually, I would not buy it NOW. It is the first edition. If you do not need desperately the apparati, I would wait at least for version 2. And, then, perhaps Bibleworks will have the apparati, too. :)

David Kummerow
12-09-2004, 05:16 PM
As I said elsewhere (http://www.bibleworks.com/forums/showpost.php?p=2417&postcount=8):

"The true benefit of SESB is not just that we now have the critical apparatus in a Bible software package, but also that the program offers the opportunity of conducting phrase- and clause-level searches (eg I could do a search for all the hebrew verbless clauses which have 'anoki as subject; in the past I would have to conduct a search on all cluases containing 'anoki and then sift out all the verbal clauses). The program exploits the database of the Werkgroep Informatica (see http://www.th.vu.nl/~wiweb/const/ (http://www.th.vu.nl/%7Ewiweb/const/))."

Now, I have heard reports that the Logos technology which SESB is built on was rushed through quickly such that the program at present suffers some searching problems. However, you would think that all this would be corrected in an update or version 2. The searching ability offered by this program in my opinion is the start of the next generation of possibilities for searching the biblical text. The database it uses is the result of many years' worth of efforts by those involved in the Werkgroep Informatica. Personally, I think it is a must that BW also offer (at least as an optional add-on) this same database since the level of searching has now been taken to the next stage. (Personally, I also think having this database in BW is of much more importance than having the apparatus since we can always refer to our print edition(s) - but we can't use this database if we haven't got it.) I would like to use the database in my program of choice, BW, and not have to purchase the additional SESB package. I don't know what to do at the moment also, for I have BW 6 but I also need access to the level of searching offered in SESB.

To answer your question, then: hang back and see what happens for the moment. If BW can't implement the database, then go with SESB. By then the bug problems may have been fixed anyway. But if BOTH programs begin to offer the database, then you have a choice to make on other grounds: useability; included versions; customer support; etc.

Hope this helps some.

David Kummerow.

Glenn Weaver
12-09-2004, 06:16 PM
Dear David,

Thank you for the correction. You are right--there is more to the SESB than simply apparati. Working mostly in the NT, I guess I forgot that. :-)

12-09-2004, 06:49 PM
Well guess what guys, I am now part of the bibleworks family, picked up a copy of bibleworks 6 today :) I am so used to Logos that its alittle difficult to get used to this set up. I just finished my first quarter at Seminary and just finished my intensive greek yesterday so im just learning NT greek. However I can tell that the combination of using Logos WITH bibleworks will be something special. On a sidenote, is Bibleworks making version 7 anytime soon because if so, im thinking i should take this back and wait for version 7, however if 7 is atleast a year away, I will keep this. Let me know what you all have heard. Thanks,


Ben Spackman
12-09-2004, 06:56 PM
Hey Alan.
1) Try running a morphology search on the New Testament (GNM) or Old Testament (WTM).
2)Try running the same search on Logos.
3) Proceed to wipe drool off of keyboard :D

(From a user who appreciates the strong points of BOTH programs as well. Get used to the ALT-TAB combination!)

Michael Hanel
12-09-2004, 07:09 PM
On a sidenote, is Bibleworks making version 7 anytime soon because if so, im thinking i should take this back and wait for version 7, however if 7 is atleast a year away, I will keep this. Let me know what you all have heard. Thanks,

Not sure that anything has been mentioned. There will be a version 7, but who knows when. In the past the BW folk have offered discounted upgrade prices to people who have receipts of purchases within say 60 days of the release of BW6, so I would imagine that type of policy would again happen. I doubt BibleWorks 7 is over a year away, but I certainly don't think it's coming out in the near future. The BW folk work on putting together the best package they can and when they have enough that they think is worth the new release, they'll have BW7 out. I know they're working on putting more meat into the program, so it'll be worth it no matter when it comes out :cool:

Mike Hanel
MA Classics Student Washington U
MDiv Student Concordia Seminary

Joe Fleener
12-09-2004, 07:30 PM

Welcome to the family! BW is a great tool and there are really great people who stand behind it. You will not regret your purchase.

In addition, you get a great place like this to "hang out." :)

12-09-2004, 08:06 PM
Thanks guys for all of your help. Im awfully excited :)


David Kummerow
12-11-2004, 01:01 AM
I have become aware of a review of the SESB package. See:


However, note that the author says: "Being not a Hebrew scholar, I decided to stick to fairly easy queries (easy if you know Hebrew, that is)." Thus the review unfortunately does not cover the WIVU database, which for me is the main drawcard of the package. There is a section from the Editor's introduction here


which explains a little of the advantage(s) of the database.

If BW has a focus towards "original languages" and if the WIVU database is where it is "at" in regards to searching the Hebrew Bible, then I can't wait to see BW also offer this level of searching.

David Kummerow