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Thread: English translation of the Vugate ?

  1. #1
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    Default English translation of the Vugate ?

    Dear friends,

    teaching Latin, I want to use more beneficial texts than Ovid (and the old mythological texts) and so forth, that's why I wanted to use the Latin Vulgate for exercises. My thanks goes to BibleWorks for the VULM Version of the Vulgate with the great morphological and lexical Infos (not always correct - but not many Errors). A great help indeed ! Now I'd be interested in an English Translation of the Vulgate - just to control my own Translation. There is something in the Internet: www.vulgate.org - but I haven't checked the qualtity. Is there a modul for Bibleworks of an English Vulgate Translation (maybe the one mentioned above)?
    If not please let me know as well !
    Yours
    Peter, Germany

  2. #2
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    Quote Originally Posted by Peter View Post
    Dear friends,

    teaching Latin, I want to use more beneficial texts than Ovid (and the old mythological texts) and so forth, that's why I wanted to use the Latin Vulgate for exercises. My thanks goes to BibleWorks for the VULM Version of the Vulgate with the great morphological and lexical Infos (not always correct - but not many Errors). A great help indeed ! Now I'd be interested in an English Translation of the Vulgate - just to control my own Translation. There is something in the Internet: www.vulgate.org - but I haven't checked the qualtity. Is there a modul for Bibleworks of an English Vulgate Translation (maybe the one mentioned above)?
    If not please let me know as well !
    Yours
    Peter, Germany
    Peter, I may be wrong on this one, but I'm pretty sure the Douay-Reims version is based on the Vulgate.

    Best wishes during this Easter season
    χριστὸς ἀνέστη έκ νεκρῶν

  3. #3
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    Quote Originally Posted by Donald Cobb View Post
    Peter, I may be wrong on this one, but I'm pretty sure the Douay-Reims version is based on the Vulgate.

    Best wishes during this Easter season
    χριστὸς ἀνέστη έκ νεκρῶν
    Thanks, Donald ! I think that is what I need - there is no German Vulgate Translation available (but planned), so the DR is the best for me currently. Not very modern, but it serves my needs.

    Iesus mortuus est et resurrexit - veni cito Domine !

    Yours
    Peter, Germany

  4. #4
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    Yes, DRA was translated from the Vulgate.
    Concerning German translations of the Vulgate: parts of the Apocrypha in Luther's German Bible were translated from the Vulgate, since there was no Greek text available at the time. I would have to look into it more to find out which parts (if not all) those were, and if LUT in BibleWorks actually retains Luther's translation in the Apocrypha, or whether it has been updated too.
    Mark Eddy
    Last edited by Mark Eddy; 04-21-2014 at 12:38 AM.

  5. #5
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Eddy View Post
    Yes, DRA was translated from the Vulgate.
    Concerning German translations of the Vulgate: parts of the Apocrypha in Luther's German Bible were translated from the Vulgate, since there was no Greek text available at the time. I would have to look into it more to find out which parts (if not all) those were, and if LUT in BibleWorks actually retains Luther's translation in the Apocrypha, or whether it has been updated too.
    Mark Eddy
    Dear Mark,
    a good hint ! Thank you - I can check this out. One question: do today's English speaking People understand the DRA easily? For me there are some uncommon words contained and I doubt that they are used today. Well, some years old. I think I'll get the German Vulgate Translation when finished, but by now I check my Translations by the DRA and the VULM info, which are very beneficial (thanks again, BibleWorks for including this valuable module - I like it and only some few remarks are disputable).

    The DRA is sometimes old fashioned - at least in my Impression as a foreign Reader.

    Yours
    Peter, Germany

  6. #6
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    An interesting project, Peter! The Douay-Rheims is well known for using terminology that was archaic, obscure, or overly Latinate even for English speakers of its own day (for instance, "predestinated" in Rom 1:4). Modern-day English readers would find many of these terms quite unfamiliar.

    I see, by the way, that even Vulgate.org includes the D-R as its English version. Contemporary Catholic versions, of course, are based directly on the Hebrew and Greek, so that there is not much call for a translation of the Vulgate. It's possible that there is a more modern English translation of the Vulgate in existence, whether authorized by the Catholic Church for common use or a more academic/scholarly version; but it might take some research to find this out.
    David Rensberger
    Atlanta, Georgia

  7. #7
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    Quote Originally Posted by DavidR View Post
    An interesting project, Peter! The Douay-Rheims is well known for using terminology that was archaic, obscure, or overly Latinate even for English speakers of its own day (for instance, "predestinated" in Rom 1:4). Modern-day English readers would find many of these terms quite unfamiliar.

    I see, by the way, that even Vulgate.org includes the D-R as its English version. Contemporary Catholic versions, of course, are based directly on the Hebrew and Greek, so that there is not much call for a translation of the Vulgate. It's possible that there is a more modern English translation of the Vulgate in existence, whether authorized by the Catholic Church for common use or a more academic/scholarly version; but it might take some research to find this out.
    As you say this as English native Speaker, I'm somehow satisfied by having some problems with some strange syntactical and semantical ways of the DR Translation, David. Yes: "archaic, obscure, or overly Latinate" fits my impression. But I think it's ok despite for my needs, as I want to use it just as control of my own Translation. The reason is that I want the students to read something beneficial for them and I'm meanwhile bored with the fairy tales of Ovid and the other folks. It's ok to learn Latin by translating these texts, but "qui bono" ?

    >Modern-day English readers would find many of these terms quite unfamiliar.
    That makes me feel better !

    My personal own interest nearby is to check the Latin readings of the Vetus Latina, the hypothetical Greek base text of the Vulgate is not of my uttermost interest. And the Greek text of the modern Revision of the Vulgate is the NA text - which is known. If you have a textcritical interest in the earliest Latin MSS, then see the Publisher's site of the Vetus Latina Editions http://www.vetus-latina.de/ - unfortunately faar to expensive to have them all (at least for me privately).

    >"predestinated
    I wouldn't have taken this word as unusual - but maybe (I don't know but would be interested) some of the Latin based words imported into English are from the Vulgate or its overliterall and latinized translation as the DR.

    >but it might take some research to find this out
    Thank you - it's ok for me to have the DR for BibleWorks meanwhile - then sometimes a German translation gets finished (as they did for the LXX recently).


    Yours
    Peter, Germany

  8. #8
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    Peter,

    You may find the Catholic Public Domain Version helpful. It was finished in 2009, and according to its metadata was translated from the Vulgate. It states:

    The Holy Bible, Catholic Public Domain Version, translated from the Latin Vulgate, using the Challoner Douay Rheims as a guide, by Ronald L. Conte Jr. The entire text and all related files are in the public domain.
    It can be found online here: http://www.sacredbible.org/catholic/index.htm

    Hope this helps,
    Scott.

  9. #9
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    Yes, a major reason for the Latinisms of the Douay-Rheims version is that the translators tended to prefer not to actually translate theological technical terms into ordinary English, but to use or even create English words derived from them. Quite an interesting contrast with William Tyndale. (And perhaps with Luther, but I know nothing about Luther's Bible translation.)

    Ah yes, the Vetus Latina! My teacher in graduate school, the late Nils Alstrup Dahl, was knowledgeable about that version, and sought to interest his students in it (in the long-ago 1970s!). I did find it somewhat interesting at the time, but haven't thought much about it since then. But it does bring back pleasant memories of trying to understand the issues when I click on the link you provided and see once again the names Bonifatius Fischer, the Erzabtai Beuron, and Hermann Josef Frede!
    David Rensberger
    Atlanta, Georgia

  10. #10
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    Quote Originally Posted by DavidR View Post
    Yes, a major reason for the Latinisms of the Douay-Rheims version is that the translators tended to prefer not to actually translate theological technical terms into ordinary English, but to use or even create English words derived from them. Quite an interesting contrast with William Tyndale. (And perhaps with Luther, but I know nothing about Luther's Bible translation.)

    Ah yes, the Vetus Latina! My teacher in graduate school, the late Nils Alstrup Dahl, was knowledgeable about that version, and sought to interest his students in it (in the long-ago 1970s!). I did find it somewhat interesting at the time, but haven't thought much about it since then. But it does bring back pleasant memories of trying to understand the issues when I click on the link you provided and see once again the names Bonifatius Fischer, the Erzabtai Beuron, and Hermann Josef Frede!

    Luther's is different - he translated the Greek TR Text, provided by Erasmus, not a Latin Vorlage. And he tried to find common German Terms for all the words in the text (he created some very new Terms) - all in all was this endeavor ok, but nowerdays some Translations are exacter. The Vetus latina is just for very interested poeple - but I find it more interesting than the younger Vulgate with ist unified text. But that's just my own personal interest.

    It was pleasure getting help here ! Greetings to all helpers !
    Yours
    Peter

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