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Thread: [Q] How to find all verses in which a word occurs N or more times?

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  1. #1

    Default [Q] How to find all verses in which a word occurs N or more times?

    Can this be done via the menus (in which cast I've not yet found it ) or is there a morphology string that could accomplish this task? Thanks, in advance, Michael
    Often wrong, never in doubt

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    201

    Default A possible answer

    Quote Originally Posted by mtp1032 View Post
    Can this be done via the menus (in which cast I've not yet found it ) or is there a morphology string that could accomplish this task? Thanks, in advance, Michael
    A. I am not one of the Michaels. Sorry.
    B. I found you question ambiguous. I assume you want to find multiple occurrences of one specific word.

    In version NRS I used this search:
    'earth *99 earth *99 earth
    and got 4 verses where "earth" was used 3 times (in 26.5 seconds).
    'earth *99 earth
    got 71 verses with 2 or 3 occurrences (in 0.46 seconds).
    'lord *99 lord *99 lord
    got 115 verses with 3 or 4 occurrences (in 205 seconds).
    'lord *99 lord *99 lord *99 lord
    after 15+ minutes I Aborted the search; status bar said it was compiling.

    If I understand correctly, *99 means there may be 0-99 words between the earths (or lords).

    Hope this helps.

    --Jim

    P.S. From a little more experimenting, it appears that 3 is the practical limit for this technique.
    I tried using the "lord" search, with the hits from 3 lords as the search limits.
    With a "PHRASE search" ['] it didn't seem to get out of the 'Compile' stage.
    With a "Linear PHRASE" search [;], which was much slower for 2 0r 3 hits, it did seem to keep chugging. The status text looked like it eventually quit, so I aborted the search, to discover that it must have kept going. It reported 8 verses in 565 seconds, got into 2Ch before I aborted.
    Last edited by Jim Wert; 07-19-2013 at 01:38 PM. Reason: added post script

  3. #3

    Default Is this more specific?

    I want to be able to execute a computer-based search whose objective is to find all verses in which a specified Hebrew word, or Strong’s Number occurs N times (where N is an integer between 1 and 99).
    For example, suppose I specify the Hebrew word אָרֶץ:

    • If N = * (or is not specified), the search will find and display exactly 853 verses in which אָרֶץoccurs 1 or more times. This is the current behavior.
    • If N = 3, the search will find and display 21 verses with exactly 3 occurrences of אָרֶץ
    • If N = 4, the search will find and display 1 verse with exactly 4 occurrences of אָרֶץ
    • If N = 5, the search will find and display 1 verse with exactly 5 occurrences of אָרֶץ

    I hope this clears up any confusion you may have,
    Blessings,
    Michael
    Often wrong, never in doubt

  4. #4
    Join Date
    Jan 2008
    Posts
    201

    Default

    Thank you, that is a very helpful elaboration.

    I am not aware of any automated way in BW to do what you request. (By the way, I could not replicate your statistics using WTT/WTM; form gave fewer hits, lemma gave more.)

    The way I showed above can be used with some extra steps.
    • Do the normal search, create a verse list from the result, using the Verse List Manager (VLM).
    • Do the search for two or more occurrences, using the VLM load and compare it to the normal one to create a list of verses with only 1 hit.
    • Do a search for three or more occurrences. Using the VLM load and compare it to the two-hit list to create a list of verses with 2 and only 2 hits.
    • Manually inspect the 3 or more occurrences search results pane to see the verses that are marked as *4 or *10 (for some reason BW thinks that the 5 occurrences verse has 10 hits in it).

    My results, using the lemma search, were:
    5 times = 1 verse
    4 times = 3 verses
    3 times = 32 verses
    2 times = 238 verses
    1 time = 1916 verses

    I did not do the VLM steps, but depended on the statistics that BW reported. For non-standard searches I have in a few situations found the VLM counts to be more reliable than the reported search statistics.

    There is a small learning curve to use the VLM; once you've done it a few times it will go quickly. One way to open it is the F7 key.

    --Jim

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Mar 2004
    Posts
    839

    Default duplicate word search

    Quote Originally Posted by Jim Wert View Post
    A. I am not one of the Michaels. Sorry.
    B. I found you question ambiguous. I assume you want to find multiple occurrences of one specific word.

    In version NRS I used this search:
    'earth *99 earth *99 earth
    and got 4 verses where "earth" was used 3 times (in 26.5 seconds).
    'earth *99 earth
    got 71 verses with 2 or 3 occurrences (in 0.46 seconds).
    'lord *99 lord *99 lord
    got 115 verses with 3 or 4 occurrences (in 205 seconds).
    'lord *99 lord *99 lord *99 lord
    after 15+ minutes I Aborted the search; status bar said it was compiling.

    If I understand correctly, *99 means there may be 0-99 words between the earths (or lords).

    Hope this helps.

    --Jim

    P.S. From a little more experimenting, it appears that 3 is the practical limit for this technique.
    I tried using the "lord" search, with the hits from 3 lords as the search limits.
    With a "PHRASE search" ['] it didn't seem to get out of the 'Compile' stage.
    With a "Linear PHRASE" search [;], which was much slower for 2 0r 3 hits, it did seem to keep chugging. The status text looked like it eventually quit, so I aborted the search, to discover that it must have kept going. It reported 8 verses in 565 seconds, got into 2Ch before I aborted.
    Hint: enter the search on the command line and then open the Advanced Search Engine. It is much quicker for this kind of search.
    Mike

  6. #6

    Default A general way...

    Reading the first post, I thought initially that the intent was to find any verse that used any word N # of times.

    As MBushell noted, use the Graphical Search Engine=GSE. The search will run much more quickly.

    If you are looking for any word repeated N # of times (and you are not interested in specifying what that word is), try the attached QF files. One is for Hebrew WTM, the other for Greek BGM.
    I started with this command line entry: '#1 *25 #1 *25 #1

    You will note that using "#1" is a way of asking that all the words be the same. The *25 is arbitrary. You can in/decrease that as you wish.
    With that command line, I then opened the GSE which set up my initial parameters.
    Running a search mostly returned hits of verses with multiple conjunctions, prepositions, particles, or pronouns.
    Note in my GSE query that I eliminated those by double-clicking the first word box and add inclusion/exclusion elements. (That's why the first box has the +/- in it.)
    As you seek to limit your results you may choose to add more exclusion words/forms.

    Use that pattern to look for 2 or 4 or 5 or ... more words.

    Word used 3x in verse.BGM.qf
    Word used 3x in verse.WTM.qf
    Mark G. Vitalis Hoffman
    Professor of Biblical Studies
    Lutheran Theological Seminary at Gettysburg
    ltsg.edu - CrossMarks.com
    Biblical Studies and Technological Tools

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