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Thread: Punctuation?

  1. #1
    Join Date
    Nov 2004
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    3

    Default Punctuation?

    I have a very quick question about punctuation in the LXX (LXT): am I right in thinking that it doesn't contain punctuation at the end of each verse (if so, is there a way I can activate this feature)? When I compare the BW's output with the LXX on TLG there's quite a difference. Or am I misreading it (which is more than possible!)?

    Many thanks!

    Steve

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
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    Default

    You're right. There currently is no punctuation in LXT or the BGT Old Testament in BibleWorks.Mark Eddy

  3. #3
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    Nov 2004
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    Many thanks for your reply - do you know if there's a reason for this (and is punctuation is going to be added at a later stage)?

    Many thanks, again!

    Steve

  4. #4
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    Apr 2004
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    I don't speak definatively for the programmers, but what I know is that BibleWorks received the LXT databases without punctuation. And nobody has yet taken the time to add punctuation. Eventually when the database creators (or a volunteer editor?) adds punctuation, BW will include it.

    Here is the relavent information in the auto-info window if you place your cursor over "BGT":
    The LXX MRT (machine readable text) was prepared by the TLG (Thesaurus Linguae Graecae) Project directed by Theodore F. Brünner at University of California, Irvine. Further verification and adaptation towards conformity with the individual Goettingen editions that have appeared since 1935 (9th Edition reprint in 1971) is in process by the CATSS Project, University of Pennsylvania. The various LXX OT Apocryphal/Deutero-Canonical books are included. Now included are the substantial text variations and multiple text types (assuming Codex Vaticanus as standard) from the Theodotian revision, Codex Alexandrinus, and Codex Sinaiticus. But not yet included are the textual variants as encoded from the apparatuses of the best available editions (especially Goettingen, Cambridge), and reformatted for computer by the Philadelphia team of the in-process CATSS Project under the direction of R. Kraft.

    Hope this is enlightening.
    Mark Eddy

  5. #5

    Default

    Has there been any progress on this? Punctuation in Ralhfs LXX would be nice to have for readability (and Apostolic Fathers, Jospehus, etc.). Also, will the individual Goettingen editions be made available at some point?

  6. #6

    Default

    16 months later, and I was wondering if Bibleworks is planning on adding the punctuation. I was also curious about the Göttingen critical edition volumes of the LXX. Logos has the Göttingen LXX on pre-pub, and their Rahlfs LXX has had punctuation for years.

  7. #7
    Join Date
    May 2010
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    286

    Default

    Doulos, you can download the LXX w/ punctuation from e-Sword free of charge. The program is also free to download.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mark Eddy;2397

    Here is the relavent information in the auto-info window if you place your cursor over "BGT":[FONT=Arial
    ... But not yet included are the textual variants as encoded from the apparatuses of the best available editions (especially Goettingen, Cambridge), and reformatted for computer by the Philadelphia team of the in-process CATSS Project under the direction of R. Kraft.

    [/FONT]Hope this is enlightening.
    Mark Eddy
    Although, this wasn't the original point of the thread this is a great discussion.
    For, those who would like to see datebase Mark Eddy is refering to, and for those who might like to try to create their own original text here is a sample from the CATTS database spoken of above.


    Annotated Sample of Variant Text Notations (Ruth 3.5-6)


    book verse
    | chp | item
    | | | | sub-variant {comments}
    | | | | |
    RT 03 05(0100) +<<gk>KAI\</gk> 18 {pr type reading with
    RT 03 05(0200) <gk>EI)=PEN</gk> a <gk>KAI/-DE/</gk> variation
    RT 03 05(0301) <gk>DE\</gk>] > 18 in MS 18}
    RT 03 05(0401) <gk>*ROUQ</gk>] > (~)OA-OL(~) {possible transpostion}
    RT 03 05(0500) <gk>PRO\S</gk>
    RT 03 05(0601) <gk>AU)TH/N</gk>]
    RT 03 05(0602) : <gk>AU)TH=|</gk> b {alternative readings}
    RT 03 05(0603) : <gk>AU)TO/N</gk> o*
    RT 03 05(0700) + <gk>*ROUQ</gk> (~)OA-OL(~) {balances earlier "(~)"}
    RT 03 05(0800) <gk>*PA/NTA</gk>
    RT 03 05(0901) ,] > (B-M) {punctuation difference}
    RT 03 05(1000) <gk>O(/SA</gk>
    RT 03 05(1101) <gk>E)A\N</gk> ABacfkxb2] {base text attestation}
    RT 03 05(1102) : <gk>A)\N</gk> MN<gk>*D</gk>(10)bdeghijlmnopqrstuvwa2e2
    RT 03 05(1200) <gk>EI)/PH|S</gk>
    RT 03 05(1300) + <gk>PRO/S</gk> bcx {simple plus}
    RT 03 05(1401) +:<gk>ME</gk> bcx {complex plus}
    RT 03 05(1402) :+<gk>MOI *D</gk>(10)fhipqrtv OL OS
    RT 03 05(1403) :+mihi OA OC OE
    RT 03 05(1501) ,] > (B-M)
    RT 03 05(1600) <gk>POIH/SW</gk>
    RT 03 05(1700) .
    RT 03 06(0101) <gk>KAI\</gk>] > OL(>5) {extensive minus in OL}
    RT 03 06(0201) <gk>KATE/BH</gk>] > OL(>5)
    RT 03 06(0300) + <gk>*ROUQ</gk> glnoptvwe2
    RT 03 06(0401) <gk>EI)S</gk>] > OL(>5)
    RT 03 06(0501) <gk>TO\N</gk>] > OL(>5)
    RT 03 06(0502) :<<gk>TH\N</gk> b'glnoptvwe2
    RT 03 06(0601) <gk>A(/LW</gk>] > OL(>5)
    RT 03 06(0602) : <gk>A(/LWNA *D</gk>(10)(vid)cghlmnoprtvwa2e2 {vid notation}
    RT 03 06(0700) + , (B-M) {punctuation added}
    RT 03 06(0800) <gk>KAI\</gk>
    RT 03 06(0900) <gk>E)POI/HSEN</gk>
    RT 03 06(1001) <gk>KATA\</gk>]
    RT 03 06(1002) : <gk>TA\</gk> 74 76
    RT 03 06(1100) <gk>PA/NTA</gk>
    RT 03 06(1201) ,] > (B-M)
    RT 03 06(1300) <gk>O(/SA</gk>
    RT 03 06(1401) <gk>E)NETEI/LATO</gk>]
    RT 03 06(1402) : <gk>EI)=PEN</gk> u
    RT 03 06(1501) <gk>AU)TH=|</gk>] > OL
    RT 03 06(1502) : <gk>AU)TH/N</gk> oe2
    RT 03 06(1600) <gk>H(</gk>
    RT 03 06(1700) <gk>PENQERA\</gk>
    RT 03 06(1800) <gk>AU)TH=S</gk>
    RT 03 06(1900) .
    11. Differences between Rahlfs and Cambridge (MS B)


    RT 01 02(1401) <gk>KAI\</gk> (=c(a?)q(b) 236 [etc.])] >(>6) Bc*(~)q* OE(f)
    RT 01 02(1501) <gk>O)/NOMA</gk> ([etc. as above])] >(>6) Bc*(~)q* OE(f)
    RT 01 02(1601) <gk>TH=|</gk> (=c(a?) 236 [etc.])] >(>6) Bc*(~)q* OE(f)
    RT 01 02(1701) <gk>GUNAIKI\</gk> ([etc. as above])] >(>6) Bc*(~)q* OE(f)
    RT 01 02(1801) <gk>AU)TOU=</gk> (=c(a?)q(B) 236 [etc.])] >(>6) Bc*(~)q* OE(f)
    RT 01 02(1901) <gk>*NWEMIN</gk> (R)] >(>6) Bc*(~)q* OE(f)

    RT 01 04(0501) <gk>*MWABI/TIDAS</gk> (=A)]
    RT 01 04(0502) : <gk>*MWABEI/TIDAS *B

    RT 01 15(1301) <gk>H(</gk>] > B

    RT 02 12(0901) <gk>KAI\</gk>] > Ba

    RT 02 16(1401) <gk>A)/FETE</gk> AMNabdefhijkmqrsuxb2 OA OE(c) OS] > Bca2 OC
    OL (?)

    RT 03 16(1601) <gk>*TI/S</gk> Aacgloxe2 OC OS] > B
    RT 03 16(1701) <gk>EI)=</gk> Aacgloxe2 OC OS] > Bbna2 OE

    RT 04 13(0801) <gk>KAI\</gk>] > Ba2-OE(f)(>9) blgnowe2
    RT 04 13(0901) <gk>E)GENH/QH</gk>] > Ba2-OE(f)(>9) blgnowe2
    RT 04 13(1001) <gk>AU)TW=|</gk>] > Ba2-OE(f)(>9) OL
    RT 04 13(1101) <gk>EI)S</gk> (OS sub &)] > Ba2-OE(f)(>9) bglnw OE(c) OL
    RT 04 13(1201) <gk>GUNAI=KA</gk> (OS sub &)] > Ba2-OE(f)(>9) OL
    RT 04 13(1401) <gk>KAI\</gk>] > Ba2-OE(f)(>9) OE(c)(>4)
    RT 04 13(1501) <gk>EI)SH=LQEN</gk>] > Ba2-OE(f)(>9) OE(c)(>4)
    RT 04 13(1601) <gk>PRO\S</gk>] > Ba2-OE(f)(>9) OE(c)(>4)
    RT 04 13(1701) <gk>AU)TH/N</gk>] > Ba2-OE(f)(>9) OE(c)(>4)

    RT 04 15(2201) <gk>SOU</gk>] > B

    RT 04 19(1301) <gk>*AMINADAB</gk> A]
    RT 04 19(1303) : <gk>*AMEINADAB</gk> BMNacdegijklmnopqrtuvwxya2b2e2

    RT 04 20(0201) <gk>*AMINADAB</gk> A OC OL]
    RT 04 20(0203) : <gk>*AMEINADAB</gk> BMNabcdegijklmnopqrtuvwxya2b2e2
    //end of article//
    (link)
    Brian K. Mitchell
    חפשו בתורה היטב ואל תסתמכו על דברי
    http://www.adfontes.mitchellbk.com/


  9. #9
    Join Date
    Nov 2007
    Posts
    472

    Default

    For those desiring more info on CCAT, text check out the link below:

    http://ccat.sas.upenn.edu/gopher/


    For Biblical resources and text go here:
    http://ccat.sas.upenn.edu/gopher/tex...gion/biblical/
    Brian K. Mitchell
    חפשו בתורה היטב ואל תסתמכו על דברי
    http://www.adfontes.mitchellbk.com/


  10. #10
    Join Date
    Nov 2010
    Posts
    107

    Default Any progress here?

    Curious if anyone knows whether BibleWorks has made any progress here, i.e., if we can expect a with-punctuation LXX any time soon?

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