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Thread: HCSB now available for Bibleworks

  1. #1

    Default HCSB now available for Bibleworks

    Instructions for installing HCSB - Holman Christian Standard Bible are here...

    [link deleted -- Moderator]

    The handling of cross-references and footnotes is not as cool as it could be (NASB style), but this is a quick hack, so good enough.


    Hmm, I wonder what other versions people might want.....
    Last edited by MTan; 07-30-2004 at 12:56 PM. Reason: Link removed out of respect to Holman

  2. #2
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Posts
    25

    Default HCSB and NWT

    Is this legal?

    Peace,

    Jeremy

  3. #3

    Default Sure

    Sure it is. All web browsers download web pages and cache them in a directory for later quick retrieval. Think of this program plus Bibleworks as a really funky, highly optimized web browser. Websites give you the implicit right to download their data on your own pc, but you can't redistribute it. So give people the program (aka, funky browser back-end), but don't give people the resulting data file.

  4. #4

    Default

    About This Book...

    Holman Christian Standard Bible Author Publisher Broadman & Holman Publishers
    Nashville, TN
    web: www.broadmanholman.com Copyright Copyright 1999, 2000, 2002, 2003 by Holman Bible Publishers, Nashville Tennessee. All rights reserved. Permissions Statement The text of the Holman Christian Standard Bible may be quoted in any form (written, visual, audio or electronic) up to and inclusive of two-hundred-fifty (250) verses without the written permission of the publisher, provided that the verses do not account for more than 20 percent of the work in which they are quoted, and provided that a complete book of the Bible is not quoted.

    When the Holman Christian Standard Bible is quoted, one of the following credit lines must appear on the copyright or title page of the work.

    Scripture quotations are taken from the Holman Christian Standard Bible,
    Copyright 1999, 2000, 2002, 2003 by Holman Bible Publishers. Used by permission.

    or

    Unless otherwise noted, Scripture quotations marked "HCSB" have been taken from the Holman Christian Standard Bible,
    Copyright 1999, 2000, 2002, 2003 by Holman Bible Publishers. Used by permission.

    The twin traits of accuracy and readability make the Holman CSB the new standard in Bible translations. For everyone who ever wanted a Bible dedicated equally to precise translation and reader-friendly English, the Holman CSB is a victory. The HCSB text retains the subtle meanings of original biblical languages but without being stilted, stuffy, or difficult to read. The result is a rendering of Scripture equally suited to serious Bible study and devotional reading. Work on the Holman Christian Standard Bible began more than fifteen years ago and among more than 90 biblical scholars.

    Updates about the Holman CSB project are available by clicking here.


    ---------------------------------


    I think technically you are using more than 250 verses at once.

  5. #5
    Join Date
    Apr 2004
    Posts
    25

    Default Too bad..

    Although I am thankful for all your hard work on these and I could certainly use them, I agree. This may be pushing the limit on the license. I don't think I'm going to use them until we get a solid answer. I would hate for Holman to pull their translation from the web because people were downloading the data and putting it into other applications.

    Peace,

    Jeremy
    Last edited by jarcher; 07-29-2004 at 02:49 PM.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Posts
    9

    Exclamation

    For a similar discussion see the argument over whether the Bible Import tool for e-Sword is legal at dnspad.com.

    http://www.dnspad.com/engine/comment...5c8752be75a37e

    I still am undecided, myself.

  7. #7

    Default Oh My

    Quote Originally Posted by d-man
    For a similar discussion see the argument over whether the Bible Import tool for e-Sword is legal at dnspad.com.

    http://www.dnspad.com/engine/comment...5c8752be75a37e

    I still am undecided, myself.
    Thank you for the link. What a very sad discussion.

    It confirms my uncomfortable feeling with this technology. I was a systems engineer and programmer for 10 years, and am impressed with the technology that makes these things available, but "the laborer is worthy of his hire."

    - "To Whom much is given much is required."

    With all the new technology available and the electronic resources on the market it is very difficult for even the law to keep up, but let us all endeavor to stay "above reproach."
    Joe Fleener

    jfleener@digitalexegesis.com
    Home Page: www.digitalexegesis.com
    Blog: http://emethaletheia.blogspot.com/

    Annotated Bibliography of Online Research Tools: www.digitalexegesis.com/bibliography

    User Created BibleWorks Modules: www.digitalexegesis.com/bibleworks



    Psalm 46:11
    `#r<a'(B' ~Wra' ~yIAGB; ~Wra' ~yhi_l{a/ ykinOa'-yKi W[d>W WPr>h;

  8. #8

    Default Copyright

    First of all, copyright conditions are not determined by the owner of the content, they are determined by the copyright laws in your respective countries. A copyright licence such as the one quoted above cannot increase the restrictions beyond what copyright law allows, it can only relax restrictions. So the "250 words" has no particular effect, unless a court by coincidence also thinks 250 words is somehow important. Remember, under the right conditions you can copy a work in its entirety as fair use. (e.g. Sony Betamax vs Universal Studios).

    Secondly, there is such a thing as fair use. No copyright notice in the world can remove the legal doctrine of fair use. That's why you can video tape any program off TV that you like, even though the copyright holders don't want you to, and they went to court to try and stop you, but couldn't. Question: All of you who won't use this program - do you refuse to use your video too, because NBC or whoever doesn't like it? (They don't).

    Thirdly, if this program is illegal, then web browsers are illegal too, because they do the exact same thing as this program does, they just present the data differently. They still store the whole lot on your disk, it's just that you would have to visit every page by hand in order to get in on your disk.

    Fourthly, Google and other web spiders do this every day. They download entire web sites and dish it up again to everyone in the world. They are doing much more than this program does - not only do they copy and store the information, they mangle it, index it and they re-distribute it in a slightly different format. (Notice the "cache" links on every Google search). And they do all this without any permission from the copyright holders.

    Fifthly, there are tons of programs out there for slurping down entire web sites, so that you can browse them off-line on laptop computers. This one just happens to re-format the data at the same time. And every company in the world has proxy servers that keep copys of recently accessed web sites.

    As for the whole "worker deserves his wages" argument. If that theory is legitimate here, then it would be perfectly ok to charge an entrance admission cover charge before you walk into church. I don't know anyone who thinks that is ok. I'm working on my own bible translation. I know how much work is involved. I will not be charging for it.

    In summary, content holders have to expect legal fair use to be made of any content they distribute on the internet. For them to try and restrict the content further than copyright law allows would not be legal. Having decided to release something on the internet, if they wish to make more money they've got lots of options - distribute a version with Strongs numbers, better cross-references or whatever.

  9. #9

    Default Thank you...

    Thank you for your thoughts.

    At the end of the day each person must make their own choice. My intention was not to offend, but rather to express my "uncomfortable feeling." (Rom. 14:23)
    Joe Fleener

    jfleener@digitalexegesis.com
    Home Page: www.digitalexegesis.com
    Blog: http://emethaletheia.blogspot.com/

    Annotated Bibliography of Online Research Tools: www.digitalexegesis.com/bibliography

    User Created BibleWorks Modules: www.digitalexegesis.com/bibleworks



    Psalm 46:11
    `#r<a'(B' ~Wra' ~yIAGB; ~Wra' ~yhi_l{a/ ykinOa'-yKi W[d>W WPr>h;

  10. #10

    Default Downloader

    I have moved the location of the program to here, and bundled them together...

    [link deleted -- Moderator]

    And added some more doco for the frequently asked questions.

    I may try Wycliffe's version as the next one to tackle.
    Last edited by MTan; 07-30-2004 at 12:54 PM. Reason: Removed link at request of Holman

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