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bkMitchell
02-11-2013, 03:07 AM
If, my memory services me correctly it was on June 28th, 2011 that I ordered my copy of BibleWorks9. Meaning, that current version of BibleWorks is about a year a half old. That's not too old I guess? So by now most of BibleWorks' user base has had time to update to version 9 and play around with it. So, after using and getting to know BibleWorks9 I pose the following:



What would you like to see in version 10 of BibleWorks?
Is, there anything that you would like BibleWorks to retain?
Is, there anything that you would like BibleWorks to get rid of?
Is, there anything that you would like BibleWorks to add or change?

MortenJensen
02-11-2013, 06:00 AM
Two things:
- BWs dealbreaker to me is the Summary Tab. That's where I start all my exegesis. So: I would like BW to add more tagged modules. As many grammars and dictionaries as possible. It is already quite good - but one resource that would be really really helpful is the Baylor series on the Greek text. As far as I can see, the Resource Tab is unmatched by Accordance and Logos - and if BW keeps adding resources with "Focus on the Text" rather than just books in East and West, they will keep a lead here!
- They should work on the text-collections. It is next to impossible at the moment to get students to find a text. Where is "Songs of Solomon" hidden? Which books should I open to have all my translations of it and so on. As flexible as it is to group texts in languages, it is also a mess from a plain user-perspective where a grouping into text-category would be much more helpful.

So:
- keep the "Focus on the Text".
- get some user-feedback from newbies and instructors to flatten the steep learning curve demanded for new users.

Morten

MortenJensen
02-11-2013, 06:59 AM
Forgot one thing: I know it has been discussed countless times, but it is a problem for BW not having an iOS/Android-version. Just something small and downscaled. Something that would enable you to have a couple of bible-versions and the Hebrew and Greek texts on you all the time.

At least: This is a deal-breaker to many of my students and I had a hard time convincing them to buy BW and not Accordance for this reason alone.

The windows-tab-solution is not helping a lot here. Android and Apple are selling much much more than windows-tabs.

This is not to start another round on this issue. I am just afraid that sales are hurting for this reason.

Morten

Donald Cobb
02-11-2013, 08:51 AM
If, my memory services me correctly it was on June 28th, 2011 that I ordered my copy of BibleWorks9. Meaning, that current version of BibleWorks is about a year a half old. That's not too old I guess? So by now most of BibleWorks' user base has had time to update to version 9 and play around with it. So, after using and getting to know BibleWorks9 I pose the following:



What would you like to see in version 10 of BibleWorks?
Is, there anything that you would like BibleWorks to retain?
Is, there anything that you would like BibleWorks to get rid of?
Is, there anything that you would like BibleWorks to add or change?



Great question. For #2 and 3, Just about everything is worth retaining. The only thing for which I've never really seen the usefulness in BW9 is the "version" pane, which gives you information you can get anyway by hovering the mouse over the version name in the Browse window.

In terms of helpful additions, I would love to see the following:

Visuals

It would be nice to have the possibility of setting single versions in the Browse Window in such a way that breaks are made according to paragraphs and not verses (you can actually do this in multiple version mode if you set it up for several verses, but it's far from ideal for at least a couple reasons). Without this, BW isn't really a great program for simply reading files.

Ressources

Greek

I would love to see some more morphologically tagged versions of non-Biblical Koine and Classical Greek texts, e.g., Epictetus, Plato, etc. Text-only versions for several of these can already be found in the User built ressources, and are easy enough to integrate. But it would be nice to have the morphology versions for the links to vocabulary and use with the search engine ("cross version search mode").

It would be very helpful to have a critical apparatus with the LXX, especially as there are sometimes whole passages that are missing in Rahlfs (e.g., a whole section of the David and Goliath passage). If it could be searched along with BGT and BGM that would be wonderful.

Any chance of getting some tagged facsimiles of some of the more important papyri, along with their transcriptions, like p46, p72, p75, etc.?

English

The Fairly recently translated English version of the LXX/Old Greek (NETS) is freely available online. Any chance of having that added?

Hebrew

In the non-vocalized Hebrew texts (Dead Sea Scrolls principally, but also the Samaritan Pentateuch in the user-built module), the שׁ (= v) and the שׂ (= f) are represented by a third letter (ש = X). This means that these texts will be eliminated from same language searches, and also come up as variants when using the Text Comparison Settings. It would be nice to harmonize all this!

Also, this may be asking for the moon, but in same language searches, I believe that the mater lectionis readings (in Qumran for example) do not show up in string searches when there are differences on that level with WTT. It would be nice to have a greater coherence between these modules (I believe it's possible to get around this by using WTM as base version, though, if I remember correctly some previous searches).

How about morphologically tagged Hebrew text of some of the important talmudic ressources?

I would love to see some improvement in the lexicons for the Targums, as well as vocalized texts for more of these than are currently available (i.e., only one for the moment).

Any chance of getting some tagged manuscript facsimiles for some of the Dead Sea Scrolls (either Biblical texts or sectarian works)?

* * * * * * * * * *

How's that for starters? IMO, these things would make a future version of BW even more powerful than it is. As an aside, I've been using BW since version 3, going back to 1997, and I've always been impressed to see how BW has evolved and kept in step with my growing needs as pastor, pastor trainer, then Seminary professor. Keep up the good work!

Donald Cobb
Aix-en-Provence, France

Peter
02-11-2013, 10:10 AM
Great question ! I'd like to see the morphological tagged OT Peschitta (available in the internet already) and an update of the CNTTS apparatus, with more features and more manuscripts. This apparatus was the key element why I updated on BW 9 and I haven't regred it.
When do you think BW 10 will be released ?
Yours in Christ !
Peter, Germany

robrecht
02-11-2013, 12:25 PM
Great question. For #2 and 3, Just about everything is worth retaining. The only thing for which I've never really seen the usefulness in BW9 is the "version" pane, which gives you information you can get anyway by hovering the mouse over the version name in the Browse window.

In terms of helpful additions, I would love to see the following:

Visuals

It would be nice to have the possibility of setting single versions in the Browse Window in such a way that breaks are made according to paragraphs and not verses (you can actually do this in multiple version mode if you set it up for several verses, but it's far from ideal for at least a couple reasons). Without this, BW isn't really a great program for simply reading files.

Ressources

Greek

I would love to see some more morphologically tagged versions of non-Biblical Koine and Classical Greek texts, e.g., Epictetus, Plato, etc. Text-only versions for several of these can already be found in the User built ressources, and are easy enough to integrate. But it would be nice to have the morphology versions for the links to vocabulary and use with the search engine ("cross version search mode").

It would be very helpful to have a critical apparatus with the LXX, especially as there are sometimes whole passages that are missing in Rahlfs (e.g., a whole section of the David and Goliath passage). If it could be searched along with BGT and BGM that would be wonderful.

Any chance of getting some tagged facsimiles of some of the more important papyri, along with their transcriptions, like p46, p72, p75, etc.?

English

The Fairly recently translated English version of the LXX/Old Greek (NETS) is freely available online. Any chance of having that added?

Hebrew

In the non-vocalized Hebrew texts (Dead Sea Scrolls principally, but also the Samaritan Pentateuch in the user-built module), the שׁ (= v) and the שׂ (= f) are represented by a third letter (ש = X). This means that these texts will be eliminated from same language searches, and also come up as variants when using the Text Comparison Settings. It would be nice to harmonize all this!

Also, this may be asking for the moon, but in same language searches, I believe that the mater lectionis readings (in Qumran for example) do not show up in string searches when there are differences on that level with WTT. It would be nice to have a greater coherence between these modules (I believe it's possible to get around this by using WTM as base version, though, if I remember correctly some previous searches).

How about morphologically tagged Hebrew text of some of the important talmudic ressources?

I would love to see some improvement in the lexicons for the Targums, as well as vocalized texts for more of these than are currently available (i.e., only one for the moment).

Any chance of getting some tagged manuscript facsimiles for some of the Dead Sea Scrolls (either Biblical texts or sectarian works)?

* * * * * * * * * *

How's that for starters? IMO, these things would make a future version of BW even more powerful than it is. As an aside, I've been using BW since version 3, going back to 1997, and I've always been impressed to see how BW has evolved and kept in step with my growing needs as pastor, pastor trainer, then Seminary professor. Keep up the good work!

Donald Cobb
Aix-en-Provence, France
I think these are all excellent suggestions!

MGVH
02-11-2013, 01:16 PM
Update the GING Greek-English lexicon w/ the new The Concise Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament by Danker
NETS (New English Translation of the Septuagint)
OT Syriac Peshitta and a translation even if it means Lamsa's
Better integration of Moody Bible Atlas (doesn't really even show up most times in Resources; would like a right-click link to a place name as happens w/ BW Bible maps)

DavidR
02-11-2013, 05:56 PM
Admittedly I wouldn't use it every day, but I would use it: Since the Vulgate Latin is available, a morphologically tagged version of it would be great!

MGVH
02-11-2013, 08:46 PM
Admittedly I wouldn't use it every day, but I would use it: Since the Vulgate Latin is available, a morphologically tagged version of it would be great!

We do have such a version already. Use VULM, VUT, or VUM. Then have the Analysis pane open. The morphology is provided for all the words in the verse and, for VULM, a gloss is provided using Whittaker's.

klapehau
02-12-2013, 01:06 PM
previously: bw is great and bw sevice is fantastic, thank you!
my wish:
a) an integrated translation tool, my english will not better :(
b) the toolbar should be all menus and submenus display with icons
c) in xref should be possible more than 1 entry in the same time
d) xref verse should open a new browser window
e) check boxes in xref to mark certain verses
f) the map module simpler user
g) caught the font size finger zoom (for tablet with win8)

that's enough for today. I hope you understand, what I mean.
God bless you,
Klaus-Peter
Germany

DavidR
02-12-2013, 01:50 PM
We do have such a version already. Use VULM, VUT, or VUM. Then have the Analysis pane open. The morphology is provided for all the words in the verse and, for VULM, a gloss is provided using Whittaker's.
Sorry for a bit of thread drift here, folks!

Mark, I don't see VUT or VUM in my installation of BW9 (current version, 9.0.012m.1). I had VUC, VUL, and VUO installed (and I generally use VUL, using VUO only in the Psalms, because it shows the Iuxta Hebraeos rather than the version made from LXX). Your post moved me to check the disc, and there I did indeed find VULM, as well as NOV, the Nova Vulgata, both of which I promptly installed, so that does get me Vulgate morphology (and thanks for that!), but of course the morphology is not searchable.

However, neither the complete online list of BW9 contents (http://www.bibleworks.com/content/full.html) nor the list of bibliographical entries shows any sign VUT or VUM. What are they exactly?

DavidR
02-12-2013, 02:00 PM
Visuals
It would be nice to have the possibility of setting single versions in the Browse Window in such a way that breaks are made according to paragraphs and not verses (you can actually do this in multiple version mode if you set it up for several verses, but it's far from ideal for at least a couple reasons). Without this, BW isn't really a great program for simply reading files.

I strongly second this one! It can be useful to focus on a small unit of the text, but generally speaking "verse-by-verse" exegesis is (or should be) a thing of the past. We need the verses as a standard reference system, but for reading, understanding, and analyzing the text, we need to work with sentence and paragraph units. Many of the texts in BW do have paragraph divisions available, and you can show those markers (in Browse Window Configuration Options). But it would be great to have the Browse Window and Browse tab in the Analysis Window have an option to display paragraphs as such, without the verse breaks.

DavidR
02-12-2013, 02:02 PM
And let me add one more: Should it really be necessary to restart the computer every time a text or two is added from the distribution discs? I just added a couple of Latin versions to my installation, and the reboot afterward seemed unduly cumbersome for such a simple modification.

Michael Hanel
02-12-2013, 02:09 PM
And let me add one more: Should it really be necessary to restart the computer every time a text or two is added from the distribution discs? I just added a couple of Latin versions to my installation, and the reboot afterward seemed unduly cumbersome for such a simple modification.

If all you did was add texts, I don't think the reboot was necessary. Usually programs when they are installed ask you to reboot because they may add this or that small thing to start up or registry and it takes a reboot for that to kick in. I assume BW installer just has that reboot message as part of the installer whether or not you do something big or little.

DavidR
02-12-2013, 02:13 PM
If all you did was add texts, I don't think the reboot was necessary. Usually programs when they are installed ask you to reboot because they may add this or that small thing to start up or registry and it takes a reboot for that to kick in. I assume BW installer just has that reboot message as part of the installer whether or not you do something big or little.
Yes, that's what I was thinking. Yet when a program updater asks me to reboot, I always think it wise to obey. Thus I guess what I want is for the installer itself to know when a reboot is really necessary and only request it when it is needed.

Michael Hanel
02-12-2013, 02:23 PM
Yes, that's what I was thinking. Yet when a program updater asks me to reboot, I always think it wise to obey. Thus I guess what I want is for the installer itself to know when a reboot is really necessary and only request it when it is needed.

See I'm much more rebellious :cool: If the computer acts funny, I might think of restarting, but otherwise I only restart or shut off my computer when I'm going to be gone for days at a time.

Lee
02-12-2013, 05:17 PM
See I'm much more rebellious :cool: If the computer acts funny, I might think of restarting, but otherwise I only restart or shut off my computer when I'm going to be gone for days at a time.

Rom. 13:1-2






;)

Mark Eddy
02-13-2013, 12:39 AM
Ressources

Greek

I would love to see some more morphologically tagged versions of non-Biblical Koine and Classical Greek texts, e.g., Epictetus, Plato, etc. Text-only versions for several of these can already be found in the User built ressources, and are easy enough to integrate. But it would be nice to have the morphology versions for the links to vocabulary and use with the search engine ("cross version search mode").
I have started morphological databases for a number of the classical or koine Greek databases which Michael Hanel has made available: Aristophanes, Epictetus, Herodotus, Plato, and Xenophon. I add to one when I do a cross-version search and find an interesting word to study. Doing a lot of "replace all" work speeds up the process. But I have been doing this in my spare time for years, and don't have more than a few "verses" in each of these databases which are completed. If anybody would like to take over on one of these, I would be willing to send you what I have to date and let you take over. Then I can concentrate on one of the others.



It would be very helpful to have a critical apparatus with the LXX, especially as there are sometimes whole passages that are missing in Rahlfs (e.g., a whole section of the David and Goliath passage). If it could be searched along with BGT and BGM that would be wonderful.

Donald Cobb
Aix-en-Provence, France
I have actually been working on this as an avocation, but it takes forever (at least doing it in my spare time, when I'm not working on a different project or doing my ministry). I am almost done with an LXX variants database which supplies the missing verses in Rahlfs with text from the Rahlfs footnotes (and in a few cases from an older LXX printed edition in my possession). I have a lot of work to do with its companion morphology database. After Easter I might have some time to work on it. Since I am taking the text from the Rahlfs footnotes, and since Rahlfs is still under copyright, I do not know if I can share this work with anybody else. But of all the databases I mentioned here, this one is the closest to being completely functional.
Mark Eddy

Glenn Weaver
02-13-2013, 08:59 AM
Hi Mark (Eddy),

I believe that the Rahlfs text (1935) is in the public domain. I believe that the German copyright laws only cover 75 years, compared to the US laws which cover 95 years. The updated Rahlfs-Hanhart text is under copyright, however.

Blessings,
Glenn

Mark Eddy
02-13-2013, 10:57 PM
Dear Glenn,
That's good to know. I guess when I have a functional LXX variants database I'll make it available to everyone God-willing.
Mark Eddy

klapehau
02-14-2013, 02:17 AM
the next wish:

h) mouse over a hebrew or greek word display the numerical value and the cross value. Search words with the same values.

God bless you,
Klaus-Peter
Germany

MortenJensen
02-14-2013, 03:42 AM
A small thing:
- in the Use-tab, I would like to see a radio button for "Use general search limits" and one for "Use OT" and one for "GT". Or maybe just a dropdown menu with all predefined ranges.

Another thing, discussed in another thread:
- I would like the Synopsis window and the Parallel window to synchronize with the searches in Command Line/Browse window - so that they will function as floating updated displays of the text viewed in the Browse window.

Finally:
- It is not possible to change keyboard-layout in Notes and Editor. This should be an easy fix.

Morten

jdarlack
02-14-2013, 08:41 AM
Hmm... As I've said before again and again, if you want to see something in BW, be sure to contact the company through the official suggestion box! They're very good to respond and keep track of things.

Rather than specific suggested resources and features, here are a few suggestions based on my experience working with students in a seminary library and working with the BW blog. I get asked the question "What Bible software should I buy?" quite often. Now, I'm certainly a HUGE FAN(ATIC) of BibleWorks, but I always end up asking a few questions of the students, and sometimes steer them away from BW (depending on their answers).

Main issue: Old Testament / Semitic language support. If a student is planning on going into Old Testament studies, I typically advise them to either start with another software package or buy BW and supplement with something else. ;) If I were to wish for ANYTHING in BW, it would be a continued "focus on the text" but with the inclusion of both sides of the Canon! I am keen to see as much added for OT studies as possible (Peshitta, LXX, Targumic texts, DSS biblical texts, various other manuscripts, etc. - both in transcription and translation, with or without parsing - preferably with). The NT text critical materials included in BW are amazing. I'd love to see this spill over to the OT.

Closely related secondary issue: More non-canonical texts of various stripes, origins and languages. Currently no one beats BW when it comes to early Jewish Greek literature being a part of a software package's base product. BW has it all - LXX, NT, Apostolic Fathers, Greek Old Testament Pseudepigrapha, Josephus, Philo . . . It's a dream come true for students working on lexical studies. Of course the expansion into other Greek literature through the BW Blog, and various user created databases is a HUGE plus. I'd love to see more developed here - even if there was just a concentrated effort on other Koine Greek texts and papyri (for the sake of Biblical Greek lexical studies). But aside from Greek, I'd love to see whatever could be added in Hebrew, Aramaic, Coptic, Syriac, Ethiopic, Latin and even Old Church Slavonic. (If it's in the cognate literature of NT studies, then it could be included . . . going back to the "main issue" above, though, Ugaritic and Akkadian would be great as well.)

A "hobbyist's" issue: When I'm not doing homework or at work, I love tinkering around with creating user created databases. I'd love to see the Version Database Compiler made to be more robust - with the ability to incorporate Unicode fonts, etc. I know that BW's current set up is super quick partly because it is not bloated with a lot of formatting, but sometimes the formatting is a part of the translation (e.g. paragraphing, italicization, bold text, etc.). Also versification and chapter constraints can be a pain. What about verse or chapter 0 for superscriptions, etc. Support of non-canonical hyperlinking in various CHM modules would be extremely helpful. It would be wonderful if a reference to Josephus, Philo, Apostolic Fathers or Pseudepigrapha in BDAG could go directly to the context (as it happens in other packages).

iOS/Android Apps: I wonder here. . . I don't know if I'd want BW to jump into the market on this, as much as I'd like to see someone develop apps and conversion tools to take BW texts (if someone has purchased BW) and put them into an iOS/Android App as needed. For instance, Palm Bible Plus used to be able to import BW texts fairly easily if someone was willing to tinker around a bit. I imagine that if someone with the programming savvy tackled the problem, a similar program could be developed for iOS/Android. The "texts" would not be available for download, but given BW's ability to export and compile versions, perhaps something could be made that could 'read' texts purchased by BW users already . . . just a thought.

MortenJensen
02-14-2013, 08:54 AM
Here is another one that should be pretty easy to implement:
- every verse-tagged resource showing up in the Resource-tab should be made available for "browse-reading" in the 4. pane. As it is possible right now under Verse with NET, Metzger etc.

This way, you could follow whichever Reference-module, you have installed without opening a help dial-box.

Morten

AbramKJ
02-14-2013, 12:11 PM
Mark Eddy--kudos to you for being willing to make the variants available. That'd be a huge helps to folks.

Agreed about NETS--that should be in here.

And while Jim Darlack's words are not Scripture, in these matters they come close, so I won't "add to" what he said. :) Except to say that if BW10 could do for Hebrew text-critical studies what BW9 did for Greek, that would be great.

The ability to drop and drag windows would be cool, too.

And better integration with Macs would also be nice, though I know BW is working on that already with BW9.

Dan Phillips
02-15-2013, 07:59 AM
Off the top of my cranium:

1. Formatted text that includes line-breaks in poetry -- or the option to have same.
2. Versions: Lexham and Modern Language Bible. The latter was a worthy translation, though it never really caught on. It's still worth referencing.
3. Make it easy to link notes in one verse to notes in another verse. If it's doable currently, I don't know how.

There may be more, but that's what comes to mind. I just really love the program as-is.

Kevin W. Woodruff
02-15-2013, 09:26 AM
http://bibleworks.oldinthenew.org/?p=699

Dan Phillips
02-15-2013, 09:53 AM
http://bibleworks.oldinthenew.org/?p=699

Thanks very much; that's the NT, but lacks the OT. I wonder if it's the same ver of NT as in Logos now?

MortenJensen
02-15-2013, 09:54 AM
Another small thing:
- when you hover over the name of the Bible in the Browse Window, it would be nice with a small popup window with info on the text (like what you get in the Analysis-tab, just, that tab is not always open).

Morten

DavidR
02-15-2013, 10:37 AM
Another small thing:
- when you hover over the name of the Bible in the Browse Window, it would be nice with a small popup window with info on the text (like what you get in the Analysis-tab, just, that tab is not always open).
Of course, this information is available by right-clicking the Bible version's abbreviation and selecting "Edit version notes for this version"; but a popup would be simpler. (And the version notes are indeed editable. I'm not quite sure to what end; I suppose one could put in things like, "This was Uncle Dave's favorite translation, and you know what was wrong with him. :) )

Kevin W. Woodruff
02-15-2013, 11:40 AM
I realize that many of these would be impractical due to copyright, but in a perfect world....
Just off the top of head, my suggestions for BibleWorks 10:

Versions:
The New English Bible
The Revised English Bible
The Holy Bible: An Improved Edition (this is in public domain) http://archive.org/details/holybiblecontain00amer
Beck's Translation
Berkeley Version
New Berkeley Version
The ESV with Apocrypha (http://www.amazon.com/English-Standard-Version-Bible-Apocrypha/dp/0195289102 )
Ronald Knox Translation
George Lamsa translation of the Peshitta
Moffat Translation
New Century Version
International Standard Version (http://www.isv.org)
St. Athanasius Academy Septuagint translation (Old Testament text in the Orthodox Study Bible)
New World Translation (probably off-limits due to copyright)
The Holy Bible: An American Translation (Smith & Goodspeed)
Christian Community Bible translation
The New Testament: A Simplified Version by Olaf Norlie
The New Testament by William Barclay
The New Testament by JB Phillips
Wuest's Expanded Translation
Translator's New Testament (British and Foreign Bible Society)
The New Testament in Modern English (The Centenary Translation) by Helen Montgomery (public domain)
The New Testament in the Language of the People by Charles B. Williams
The New Testament (translated by Richard Lattimore)
The New Testament: Recovery Version
The New Testament: A New Translation in Plain English (CK. Williams)
Weymouth's New Testament (public domain)
Ferrar Fenton translation (public domain)
Translation for Translators (Deibler)
Translator's translation (Deibler)

Greek Texts:
Novum Testamentum (Merk)
The Greek New Testament: Being the Text Translated in the New English Bible (1961) edited by RVG Tasker)
Von Soden's Text (public domain)
Souter's Text (public domain)
Vogel
Bover
Tregelles (public domain)
Wettstein (public domain)
Griesbach (public domain)
British and Foreign Bible Society (both first and second editions)
Selections from the Greek Papyri-Milligan (public domain)
Here and There among the Papyri (public domain)
Select Papyri (from the Loeb set)
Oxyrhynchus papyri (public domain)
Tebtunis papyri
Hibeh papyri

Greek Textual Criticism
Metzger's Text of the the New Testament
Encountering the Manuscripts by Comfort
Scrivener's A Plain Introduction to the Criticism of the New Testament (public domain)
A Textual Guide to the Greek New Testament-Omanson

Greek Grammars
Discourse Grammar of the Greek New Testament by Steve Runge
Prepostions and Theology -Murray Harris
Richard Young's Intermediate New Testament grammar
Buttman's Grammar (public domain)
Dana & Mantey Grammar of the Greek New Testament
Chamberlain's An Exegetical Grammar of the Greek New Testament
Moulton Grammar (full grammar, Moulton, Howard, turner)
Perschbacher's New Testament Greek Syntax
Porter's Idioms of the Greek New Testament
Goodwin's Moods and Tenses (public domain)
Goodwin's Greek Grammar (public domain)
Robertson and Davis's Intermediate Grammar (1st edition public domain)
Deissman's Light from ancient Near East (public domain)
Deismmann" Bible Studies (public domain)
Dictionary of New Testament Theology by Colin Brown
Moule's Idiom Book of the Greek New Testament
Winer's Grammar of New Testament Greek(public domain)
Syntax of the Greek New Testament-Brooks & Winbery
A Beginning -Intermediate Grammarof Hellensitic Greek-Funk

Exegetical Guides
Linguistic and Exegetical Key-Rreinecker and Rogers/Rogers and Rogers
A Grammatical Analysis of the Greek New Testament-Zerwick and Grosvenor
Baylor Handbook series
Exegetical Summaries series from the Summer Institute of Linguistics

Greek Lexical Works
Spicq's Theological Lexicon of the New Testament
Cremer's Biblio-Theological Lexicon (public domain)
Patristic Greek Lexicon-Lampe
Concise Dictionary of New Testament Greek-Trenchard
Souter's Pocket Lexicon to the Greek New Testament (public domain)
Danker's Concise Lexicon of the Greek New Testament

Latin Lexica
Oxford Latin Dictionary.
Dictionary of Ecclesiastical Latin-Stelten

Latin Grammar
Wheelock's Latin Grammar
Primer of Ecclesiastical Latin-Collins
An Introduction to Ecclesiastical Latin by HPV Nunn (public domain)

Miscellaneous Works
Bullinger's Figures of Speech (public domain)
Soncino Talmud (or a full-blown Talmud translation, Rodkinson's is not complete nor accurate)
Mishnah translation (either Danby or Neusner or both)

Hebrew & Armaic Lexica
Jastrow's Dictionalry of the Targumim,
Jenni and Westermann's Theological Lexicon of the Old Testament
Theological Dictionary of the Old Testament (TDOT)
Dictionary of Old Testament of Theology and Exegesis
Girdlestone's Synonym's of the Old Testament

Hebrew Grammars
Steinmann's Intermediate Hebrew
Williams Hebrew Syntax (Ronald J. Williams)
Van Der Merwe, Naude and Kroeze's A Biblical Hebrew Reference Grammar
Davidson's Hebrew Syntax (old and revised editions)
A Review and Reference Grammar for Biblical Hebrew (Horsnell)
Guide to Biblical Hebrew Syntax Bill T. Arnold

Kevin W. Woodruff
02-15-2013, 01:35 PM
Conybeare and Stock's Grammar of Septuagint Greek (public domain)
Gary Alan Chamberlain's The Greek of the Septuagint: A Supplemental Lexicon

Michael Hanel
02-15-2013, 11:08 PM
I realize that many of these would be impractical due to copyright, but in a perfect world....
Just off the top of head, my suggestions for BibleWorks 10:



Surely that list isn't really "off the top of your head". If so your library work has had a profound influence on the list of resources you keep on your head :p

Mark Eddy
02-15-2013, 11:20 PM
What did God tell Isaiah? "Before they call I shall answer..." von Soden and Tregelles are already availalbe for BW. See the unofficaial BibleWorks blog for downloads.
Mark Eddy

Michael Hanel
02-15-2013, 11:28 PM
What did God tell Isaiah? "Before they call I shall answer..." von Soden and Tregelles are already availalbe for BW. See the unofficaial BibleWorks blog for downloads.
Mark Eddy

Well if we're going to start counting, then so is Deissman's Bible Studies and Goodwin's Greek Grammar :)

Donald Cobb
02-16-2013, 01:08 AM
With absolutely no intent to minimize the other suggestions, many of which I'm not familiar with, I would pare down slightly Kevin's--impressive!--list and put the following as a priority:


I realize that many of these would be impractical due to copyright, but in a perfect world....
Just off the top of head, my suggestions for BibleWorks 10:

Versions:

Moffat Translation
The New Testament by William Barclay
The New Testament by JB Phillips

Greek Texts:
Selections from the Greek Papyri-Milligan (public domain)
Here and There among the Papyri (public domain)
Select Papyri (from the Loeb set)
Greek Grammars
Prepostions and Theology -Murray Harris
Buttman's Grammar (public domain)
Dana & Mantey Grammar of the Greek New Testament
Moulton Grammar (full grammar, Moulton, Howard, turner) [NB: The first two are now public domain, I believe]
Moule's Idiom Book of the Greek New Testament
A Beginning -Intermediate Grammarof Hellensitic Greek-Funk
Greek Lexical Works
Patristic Greek Lexicon-Lampe
Concise Dictionary of New Testament Greek-Trenchard
Souter's Pocket Lexicon to the Greek New Testament (public domain)
Danker's Concise Lexicon of the Greek New Testament

Latin Lexica
Oxford Latin Dictionary.

Latin Grammar
Wheelock's Latin Grammar
An Introduction to Ecclesiastical Latin by HPV Nunn (public domain)

Miscellaneous Works
Soncino Talmud (or a full-blown Talmud translation, Rodkinson's is not complete nor accurate)
Mishnah translation (either Danby or Neusner or both)

Hebrew & Armaic Lexica
Jastrow's Dictionalry of the Targumim, [yes, yes, yes!]
Jenni and Westermann's Theological Lexicon of the Old Testament


One other thing I would really like to see is this: I don't have the full-blown Logos setup and don't often use Logos apart from a few specific things, but one feature I find very helpful is the ability to save several layouts and come back to them. It's sometimes a little tedious in BW if you're working on a passage for instance with the parallel windows, plus a floating window, etc., to have to set that up again each time. Being able to save setups would be a huge advantage and time saver. Having a dozen or so tabs, as is currently the case, is very helpful, but these are more limited, and I for one have tended to use them more for permanent setups (i.e., one tab for Josephus, one tab for the Apostolic Fathers, etc.).

I would also repeat the suggestion someone made of a "mini" version for iphones, and the like. Not necessarily one that would be sold separately from the full version--I think that's where the copyright issues that BW has mentioned on several occasions would come in--but a scaled-down version for BW's regular users (that would certainly bring overall sales up as well!).

Donald Cobb
Aix-en-Provence, France

MGVH
02-16-2013, 09:41 AM
Conybeare and Stock's Grammar of Septuagint Greek (public domain)
Gary Alan Chamberlain's The Greek of the Septuagint: A Supplemental Lexicon

Conybeare and Stock's Grammar of Septuagint Greek is already in BW too!

Kevin W. Woodruff
02-16-2013, 11:24 AM
The TXT file for the complete Lexham english bible (both Old and new Testaments) is available at http://www.lexhamenglishbible.com/download/LEB.txt, but I don't have enough technical savvy to turn it into a usable file with the Version Database Compiler. If anyone is interested in taking this on as a project, I would be grateful!

MortenJensen
02-18-2013, 07:15 AM
Again another thing in the department for small items:
- when navigating the Result window lists up and down, I would like the Browse window to auto-update. There is no need to be forced to press Return for that. Why would you scroll down the list if not to look up the text in the Browse window.

Maybe this is already possible in Options?

Morten

Michael Hanel
02-18-2013, 08:57 AM
Again another thing in the department for small items:
- when navigating the Result window lists up and down, I would like the Browse window to auto-update. There is no need to be forced to press Return for that. Why would you scroll down the list if not to look up the text in the Browse window.

Maybe this is already possible in Options?

Morten

If I understand you, click in the results list and press the left and right arrows instead of the up and down arrows.

DavidR
02-18-2013, 12:39 PM
Or hold Ctrl and scroll with the mouse wheel.

DavidR
02-18-2013, 12:41 PM
One other thing I would really like to see is this: I don't have the full-blown Logos setup and don't often use Logos apart from a few specific things, but one feature I find very helpful is the ability to save several layouts and come back to them. It's sometimes a little tedious in BW if you're working on a passage for instance with the parallel windows, plus a floating window, etc., to have to set that up again each time. Being able to save setups would be a huge advantage and time saver. Having a dozen or so tabs, as is currently the case, is very helpful, but these are more limited, and I for one have tended to use them more for permanent setups (i.e., one tab for Josephus, one tab for the Apostolic Fathers, etc.)....
I strongly second this one. It would be amazingly useful to be able to have a setup created for one particular project, and another for a different project, and return to each of these as needed.

MortenJensen
02-18-2013, 02:07 PM
Thanks, Michael,

Yes, that is what I am thinking of.

However, why not make that the standard action with the up and down arrows?

Morten

Michael Hanel
02-18-2013, 02:12 PM
Thanks, Michael,

Yes, that is what I am thinking of.

However, why not make that the standard action with the up and down arrows?

Morten

I imagine there's a good reason for it. It probably would make some people unhappy if it were changed. A lot of different people use the search results in different ways so I can imagine this way appeals to some people. Sometimes if I have a particular verse in the browse window and I don't want to lose it, I turn on pop ups in the search window (right click in the search window to toggle that on) or you can toggle the search results so that the full verse shows up. In those cases, I like the current behavior because I can quickly move through the verses and uncheck the ones I don't want, while not losing the original verse that I had in the Browse Window.

Lee
02-18-2013, 04:49 PM
Thanks, Michael,

Yes, that is what I am thinking of.

However, why not make that the standard action with the up and down arrows?

Morten

I prefer it the way it is. It makes it more flexible.

Michael Tarver
02-18-2013, 06:43 PM
obviously I (we?) would like to see the NA28 incorporated. the sooner the better. I think that whenever a critical ed. such as this comes out, than soon after a new BW's edition should as well.

as stated by Morten (http://www.bibleworks.com/forums/showthread.php?5584-What-would-you-like-to-see-in-BibleWorks-10&p=29347#post29347) - more Grammars, text critical works etc. to the Open Res. Summary Window. I'd also like to see things like a tagged ed. of Bullinger's figures of speech added.

- a reading of the Greek and Hebrew text. Specifically, an audio file of the entire BGT and WTT - whereas someone can follow along in the text.

perhaps the published volumes of Biblia Hebraica Quinta

and an eclectic critical edition of the Hebrew Bible, perhaps by my b-day ;-)

Mark Eddy
02-18-2013, 08:50 PM
Well if we're going to start counting, then so is Deissman's Bible Studies and Goodwin's Greek Grammar :)
I missed Deissmann, because it is listed under "Greek Grammars." That seems odd. I guess it cannot be listed with the Greek lexicons, because it does not use the lexicon browser. But perhaps it should have a different category, such as "Word studies." Then someone could digitally produce "Light from the Ancient East" to go with it.
Mark Eddy

christlove
02-19-2013, 10:50 AM
Sometimes if I have a particular verse in the browse window and I don't want to lose it, I turn on pop ups in the search window (right click in the search window to toggle that on)

I suppose that is only working for BW 9 or am I missing something? Using BW 8.

Blessings,
Steffen

Michael Hanel
02-19-2013, 11:03 AM
I suppose that is only working for BW 9 or am I missing something? Using BW 8.

Blessings,
Steffen

That's possible. I don't have BW8 installed any more, but if it's not there (Show verse popups) when you right click in the search results list, there may be something in the Options menu, but I doubt it.

Lee
02-19-2013, 12:12 PM
I suppose that is only working for BW 9 or am I missing something? Using BW 8.


That's a recent update since BW 9.

christlove
02-20-2013, 10:05 AM
That's a recent update since BW 9.

Well, one more reason to upgrade soon...

Steffen

basilides
02-22-2013, 01:37 AM
This resource should have been included in BibleWorks years ago. It is what many loyal customers have been, are, and will be asking for. See short discussion, below.

New English Translation of the Septuagint (2009 edition).

BibleWorks is being strangely stubborn about this refusal, but it's their company, so they can, of course, do what they want. But as written in a previous post:

Regarding NETS, Accordance, and BibleWorks, there was an interesting discussion on a thread at http://www.bombaxo.com/blog/?p=1542, where Mike Bushell posted this (28 July 2009):


While Accordance is a great program, it is very expensive and there are thousands of people who do not agree that it is a better solution for those seeking high-end Bible analysis tools.... With regard to the NETS version: we tried to get this version in BibleWorks and could have done so as an external (expensive) module. We have a long standing policy of not charging for the Biblical text. We never charge for the Word of God. That is why we have no Bible versions available as modules. It is a matter of conscience with us. We prefer to absorb the royalties and cut costs everywhere we can to pay the royalties. Most publishers understand why we want to do things this way and work with us to make it possible. A very small number do not and we do not carry their translations. This allows us to provide an extensive collection of Biblical texts that no one else can match. We were unable to work out a deal with Oxford that would allow us to put NETS in the base package, so we declined their offer. I am sorry that this is an inconvenience for some people but we believe this policy is pleasing to the Lord and have no plans for changing it, no matter how much it may hurt us financially.


Well, it hurts us financially, too, because, as you said above, Accordance is very expensive, and we (who have been with BibleWorks since Hermeneutika days) have to mess with Mac emulators (though Accordance is coming out with a Windows version in 2013) and the like to have access to certain useful resources for biblical analysis (MH: who said anything about NETS being a sine qua non? It is simply useful, and much better than the current English translation done a century or so ago.).

By the way, is BibleWorks endorsing the so-called LXX as the inspired Word of God? If not, then NETS (a translation of a translation of ... ?) could be offered as a module, which would be better than nothing. Problem solved.

AbramKJ
02-22-2013, 07:04 AM

By the way, is BibleWorks endorsing the so-called LXX as the inspired Word of God?

I know, I know, not the place to engage in matters theological. (So please forgive me.)

But it is interesting to think about how Paul might have answered this question.... ;)

You bring up good points, basilides.

basilides
02-22-2013, 08:19 AM
Yes, no theological discussions, please. But I said the above in the post because I am sure the "Bibleworks" authorities do not consider the LXX to be divinely inspired, therefore it would be kosher to include the NETS in the next version (10), so I will upgrade to it in a heartbeat -- especially if NETS is included, module or otherwise. Please make it so, Mike. See Luke 6:30 for details.

MBushell
02-22-2013, 10:27 AM
Yes, no theological discussions, please. But I said the above in the post because I am sure the "Bibleworks" authorities do not consider the LXX to be divinely inspired, therefore it would be kosher to include the NETS in the next version (10), so I will upgrade to it in a heartbeat -- especially if NETS is included, module or otherwise. Please make it so, Mike. See Luke 6:30 for details.

I am sorry if our failure to license the NETS translation upsets any of our users. While there are some books in the LXX that I would not consider canonical, it is nevertheless for the most part a translation of Scripture (and quoted by Paul as such). It is in some ways like the English translations that we include which contain the Apocrypha. I know that there are a lot of people who do not understand or approve of our philosophy in this regard, but it is a core belief and I do not see it changing. The making and marketing of "new" Scripture texts has become a very lucrative enterprise and one that we do not feel is pleasing to the Lord. Our policy on selling Biblical versions as modules is the only way we have of bucking the trend. It also has the nice side effect of allowing us to put a large number of translations in our base package. If we moved to module pricing no one could afford such a collection. There is no doubt that this policy has hurt us as a company, but there are people out there who appreciate what we are trying to do. In the end the Lord will determine whether we are being foolish or faithful. BW10 is a long ways off but we do have some nice new additions planned. Mike

DavidR
02-22-2013, 10:46 AM
EDIT: This was written before I saw Mike's last post (Feb. 22, 10:27 AM). I do not wish to seem to be urging BW away from a serious moral and spiritual principle, but I do stand by the point (if it is a point!) that I'm making.

A fool rushing in here, but.... No doubt many ancient Jews did consider the LXX divinely inspired (which is the whole point of the story about 70 translators coming up with the identical translation), and that included the Greek-speakers among the Jews who founded Christianity. I'm not so sure about early non-Jewish Christians. Origen, at least, was aware of text-critical issues, and of other Jewish versions besides LXX.

But in a sense, that is neither here nor there. If BW wants to be broadly inclusive in its understanding of what constitutes the word of God in its business model (which ought to accord with one's theology, but is not necessarily the same thing), that is up to them. I'm inclined to apply Romans 14 on this (as on much else): "Let us therefore no longer pass judgment on one another" (v. 13a).

OTOH.... If this business policy causes aggravation and even harm to their customers, it could simply mean a loss of business. But perhaps ... ooh, this is getting theological, isn't it? ... it's also an occasion to "resolve instead never to put a stumbling block or hindrance in the way of another" (Rom. 14:13b). IOW, be a little flexible, and "do not let your good be spoken of as evil" (Rom 14:16).

This isn't a big deal to me personally, since I wouldn't use NETS that much anyway. But clearly it's important to a number of people. I'm consistently amazed at the flexibility that the apostle Paul models in his Christian walk, and perhaps this is indeed an occasion to bend a bit. If Oxford is being intransigent (and I imagine there is no intransigence like that of an ancient British publishing house), and if people are willing to pay what an external NETS module would cost due to that intransigence, maybe a little holy and humble flexibility is in order. After all, "It is to peace that God has called you" (1 Cor. 7:15).

basilides
02-22-2013, 08:50 PM
Not wanting very much to beat a dead horse, and perhaps what follows is due to my being dense in the head, but couldn't BibleWorks offer NETS that could be purchased as a module, an extra, an add-in, whatever, which would not, as I understand them, violate any of BibleWork's stringent policies?

MortenJensen
02-23-2013, 03:52 AM
Yes, a dead horse, I agree. Just two cents: While I personally would not mind, if BW stepped aside from the policy in this instance, then I can easily see how it would force them to do so many other times. For instance: The newest Danish version is presently not onboard due to this issue.

And if the choice is between the present policy and the Logos/Accordance price policy, I am one happy BW-customer! What we get in the package presently is beyond comparison. Take a look at how stuff like the Sinaiticus-manuscripts etc. are priced by Accordance - or Early Church Fathers.

My main worry is rather if BW can stay competitive with the present policy. My feeling is that many Logos and Accordance users get accustomed to add modules all the time. In the end, they (happily) spend far more money, than BW users do.

Morten

bkMitchell
02-23-2013, 07:06 AM
... couldn't BibleWorks offer NETS that could be purchased as a module, an extra, an add-in, ...
What, about the other publishers whose translations come with BibleWorks? Wouldn't they too want a piece of the cake if BibleWorks did what you suggest?

basilides
02-23-2013, 07:53 AM
A thousand pardons. I thought BibleWork's modules were extras, add-ons, add-ins, or whatever they are called, items that could be purchased separately and voluntarily by customers with special interests and needs, but I am mistaken. Apparently. Errare humanum est, sed in errare perseverare diabolicum, as the expressions goes.

bkMitchell
02-23-2013, 08:20 AM
...I thought BibleWork's modules were extras, add-ons, add-ins, or whatever they are called, items that could be purchased separately and voluntarily by customers with special interests and needs...

Basilides,

You, thought right! So, no need for apologies.
But translations in BibleWorks currently are not, "modules...add-ons, add-ins,..."

Could, BibleWorks add the NETS as an add-on module?


Why Doesn't BibleWorks Offer Bible Texts as Extra-Cost Add-on Modules?
Our company feels that offering Bible texts as extra-cost add-on modules is counterproductive for three main reasons. One is that we want to be positioned as far as possible for charging money for the Word of God itself, and putting all offered Bible texts in the BibleWorks base package is so far our best avenue to accomplish this. The second is that offering Bible texts as modules is more expensive, both for the customer and for us. It’s more expensive for the customer because publishers, having a much lower volume on modules, charge more per module in an attempt to make up the difference. And it’s more expensive for us because the administrative overhead in preparing and licensing individual modules is much greater than that on the prorated administrative cost of having the text in our base package. Those extra module administrative costs would also have to be passed to the customer, driving up customer Bible text module prices still more. The third reason is that customers ordering Bible texts as modules will necessarily order only the few with which they’re familiar and thus lose a chance to become exposed to other texts with which they might have profitably acquainted themselves if browsing had been available. Publishers support us in this, eager to have their texts exposed to a wide audience.(link) (http://kb.bibleworksllc.com/kmp/index.php?/article/AA-02882/97/Informational/Contents-of-BibleWorks/Why-Doesnt-BibleWorks-Offer-Bible-Texts-as-Extra-Cost-Add-on-Modules.html)

However, basilides if you and others petition Oxford and there is enough demand maybe Oxford could change their minds and allow BibleWorks to package the NETS Bible with their software at no extra charge. If, you do petition count me in, too.

Lee
02-23-2013, 12:21 PM
Surely they meant that to read


we want to be positioned as far as possible from charging money for the Word of God itself

Otherwise, it's kind of saying the opposite of what I think they mean.

basilides
02-24-2013, 12:06 AM
Well, it looks like NETS is dead and buried, as far as BibleWorks is concerned, for three frankly hard to understand business / theological reasons.

It would be useful to have access to the Göttingen LXX vs. Rahlfs LXX textual variants. Some of them are "available" online at IOSCS (http://ccat.sas.upenn.edu/gopher/text/religion/biblical/lxxvar/ (http://ccat.sas.upenn.edu/gopher/text/religion/biblical/lxxvar/1Pentateuch/)), but it would be nice to have them rendered more user-friendly and included in BibleWorks 10.

bkMitchell
02-24-2013, 08:30 PM
...It would be useful to have access to the Göttingen LXX vs. Rahlfs LXX textual variants...

It, really would!
BibleWorks has some nice resources for NT textual critics, but not much for Hebrew Bible/OT.
If, the GBS were willing to work with BibleWorks I am sure it will be possible. However, currently I have the feeling this might be difficult:


See posts #14 and #19
http://www.bibleworks.com/forums/showthread.php?4047-Critical-Apparatuses-Etc/page2&highlight=apparatus


See post #5
http://www.bibleworks.com/forums/showthread.php?5335-BHS-critical-apparatus&p=28382&highlight=#post28382

basilides
02-25-2013, 12:09 AM
Well, then, because a huge amount of LXX variants were compiled at U of Penn (and are available online, but are hard to use), wouldn't it be easy (esp. cheaper) to work out some mutually advantageous arrangement so that a user-friendly edition of the LXX variants could be incomporated into BibleWorks 10? Just a thought.

bkMitchell
02-25-2013, 03:19 AM
Well, then, because a huge amount of LXX variants were compiled at U of Penn (and are available online, but are hard to use), wouldn't it be easy (esp. cheaper) to work out some mutually advantageous arrangement so that a user-friendly edition of the LXX variants could be incomporated into BibleWorks 10? Just a thought.

That, is a good thought and it should be a possibility after all BibleWorks already has the, CATSS/Tov Hebrew-Greek Parallel Aligned Text as part of their base-package So, BibleWorks must have some type of working relationship with U of Penn already.

MBushell
02-25-2013, 02:12 PM
It, really would!
BibleWorks has some nice resources for NT textual critics, but not much for Hebrew Bible/OT.
If, the GBS were willing to work with BibleWorks I am sure it will be possible. However, currently I have the feeling this might be difficult:

We hope to have some good news soon to report on this front. Sorry to be so cryptic. Mike

AbramKJ
02-25-2013, 03:16 PM
Exciting! Very exciting!

(My original post was just, "Exciting!" but I see it has to be at least 10 characters.)

bkMitchell
02-26-2013, 07:33 AM
We hope to have some good news soon to report on this front. Sorry to be so cryptic. Mike
Thanks, for the update!

Lee
02-26-2013, 10:53 AM
We hope to have some good news soon to report on this front. Sorry to be so cryptic. Mike

My curiosity is piqued!

Michael Hanel
02-26-2013, 11:24 AM
Is the news that Mike B. suddenly inherited a small fortune and has decided to buy German Bible Society?? Cuz that would be pretty neat :D

Dan Phillips
02-26-2013, 11:46 AM
Sorry to be so cryptic. Mike

Mike Bushell is... The Crypt-Keeper!

hawkmiami
03-02-2013, 03:57 PM
I know there is already the "Summary" sub-tab under the Resources tab. I would really like to have a Summary (or "custom" or "personal" or whatever) tab that allows me to choose a host of resources to put in there based on my type of study at the time. Commonly, I would love to study with my analysis tab open, along with my personal notes, without giving up a context or browse view.

I often wish I had one tab that updated like the analysis tab with a couple of lexicons + X-refs + personal notes + Strongs + audio pronunciation + maybe even Matthew Henry scrolling off the bottom of the tab.

My suggestion may go against the very clean screen format that BibleWorks has maintained though. I want to cram all my short tools together and go get the more verbose tools with clicks when I need.

Mark Eddy
03-02-2013, 08:49 PM
You can already do almost all of this!

I know there is already the "Summary" sub-tab under the Resources tab. I would really like to have a Summary (or "custom" or "personal" or whatever) tab that allows me to choose a host of resources to put in there based on my type of study at the time.
When you are in the Resources tab, notice the sub-tabs: "Lexicons, Grammars, References." Click on each of those tabs and uncheck any resources which you do not want to see in the Summary tab. Then go back to the "Summary" subtab, and all the unwanted reference works are no longer listed. This procedure also works for the "floating" Resources window (see next).


Commonly, I would love to study with my analysis tab open, along with my personal notes, without giving up a context or browse view.
Open a "floating" or "secondary" Resources window. (Click the stack-of-books icon on the button bar, titled "Open Resource Summary Window".) Move this floating window to where you can see the rest of BW as you like it, and leave your other tabs (Analysis and Notes or Browse), where they are.


I often wish I had one tab that updated like the analysis tab with a couple of lexicons + X-refs + personal notes + Strongs + audio pronunciation + maybe even Matthew Henry scrolling off the bottom of the tab.
Your floating references window should do most of this this (lexicons & Matthew Henry), though you still have to get the cross-references, notes, and pronunciation elsewhere. Strongs numbers can be turned on in the Browse window.


My suggestion may go against the very clean screen format that BibleWorks has maintained though. I want to cram all my short tools together and go get the more verbose tools with clicks when I need.
You can open as many of these floating windows as you wish to "cram" on your screen. You can size them any size you want. Some you can minimize and call up at will, though you cannot minimize the floating Resource Summary Window.
Enjoy!
Mark Eddy

DavidR
03-03-2013, 10:41 AM
Here's another suggestion for the next or some future version of BibleWorks. Currently in Greek lexica such as BDAG references to biblical verses are hot links; hovering the mouse pointer over them can pop up the biblical text and clicking on them will load the verse(s) into the Browse Window. Nonbiblical references are not linked in this way, even ones that are part of BW, such as Philo, Josephus, and the Apostolic Fathers. I'd like to see these hot links include all texts available in a standard installation of BW, so that one could easily look up a usage in Philo or the Shepherd of Hermas. It's so important when doing studies of words to include as much of the Greek context as possible, not just the NT and LXX.

jdarlack
03-04-2013, 10:06 AM
here's another suggestion for the next or some future version of bibleworks. Currently in greek lexica such as bdag references to biblical verses are hot links; hovering the mouse pointer over them can pop up the biblical text and clicking on them will load the verse(s) into the browse window. Nonbiblical references are not linked in this way, even ones that are part of bw, such as philo, josephus, and the apostolic fathers. I'd like to see these hot links include all texts available in a standard installation of bw, so that one could easily look up a usage in philo or the shepherd of hermas. It's so important when doing studies of words to include as much of the greek context as possible, not just the nt and lxx.


Amen!!! Preach it!!!

DavidR
03-04-2013, 04:48 PM
I loooove having Pentecostals in the forum! :)

dribex
03-08-2013, 01:56 PM
The new The Concise Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament by Danker
NETS (New English Translation of the Septuagint)
Tagged Vulgate

DavidR
03-08-2013, 04:16 PM
The new The Concise Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament by Danker
NETS (New English Translation of the Septuagint)
Tagged Vulgate

I tried to post this before but somehow it failed, I think.

NETS has been requested by several people in this thread. I also requested a searchable tagged Vulgate, and learned that a tagged, but non-searchable, version (VULM) is part of the BW9 package already. See my response (http://www.bibleworks.com/forums/showthread.php?5584-What-would-you-like-to-see-in-BibleWorks-10&p=29372#post29372) to Mark Hoffman's post (http://www.bibleworks.com/forums/showthread.php?5584-What-would-you-like-to-see-in-BibleWorks-10&p=29363#post29363). Pending more information about the VUM that Mark mentioned, a seachable tagged version is still a desideratum.

Etienne M
03-09-2013, 02:59 AM
The Peshitta OT would be extraordinary,
since it's a Ist to IIId century witness,
and it would allow complete concordances inside the PES display version.

DavidR
03-09-2013, 09:59 AM
I completely agree with this suggestion, which was already made in the 7th post (http://www.bibleworks.com/forums/showthread.php?5584-What-would-you-like-to-see-in-BibleWorks-10&p=29357#post29357) in this thread.

This brings me to wonder whether this thread, which has been going on for almost a month, has perhaps now completely served its purpose and should be closed. The two most recent suggestions have both been about items that were already requested earlier in the thread, which is getting to be too long to wade through.

Long as it is, let me humbly request that, at a minimum, those who wish to add items to this list of suggestions first go through the thread and see whether their suggestion has already been made.

Lee
03-09-2013, 11:51 AM
I completely agree with this suggestion, which was already made in the 7th post (http://www.bibleworks.com/forums/showthread.php?5584-What-would-you-like-to-see-in-BibleWorks-10&p=29357#post29357) in this thread.

This brings me to wonder whether this thread, which has been going on for almost a month, has perhaps now completely served its purpose and should be closed. The two most recent suggestions have both been about items that were already requested earlier in the thread, which is getting to be too long to wade through.

Long as it is, let me humbly request that, at a minimum, those who wish to add items to this list of suggestions first go through the thread and see whether their suggestion has already been made.

I don't know . . . I think some people are posting to "second" and "third" requests that have already been made. I would imagine that the more people are interested in an addition, the more likely that BW would add it.

jdarlack
03-09-2013, 12:54 PM
Muraoka's Greek English Lexicon to the Septuagint would be a great add on. Some electronic version of his A Greek-Hebrew/Aramaic Two-way Index to the Septuagint would be a great addition to the Tov-Polak parallel MT/LXX, given that the index includes different recensions as well as apocryphal lit. I think that an index like this would not be redundant if it could be used to expand the search features of BibleWorks. (Imagine a cross-linguistic search feature where one could click a Greek word and then be lead to a search of all Hebrew and Aramaic reflexes in the OT and Qumran.)

I also think that Danker's Concise Greek-English Lexicon of the New Testament would be a worthy addition (as mentioned already). Preferably it would be in the base package (like "Baby Bauer" is now). David J.A. Clines' Concise Dictionary of Classical Hebrew would be a worthy add-on in that it would cover Qumran Hebrew as well as biblical Hebrew. Of course his multi-volume, super-expensive Dictionary of Classical Hebrew would be a real plus.

An expansion of the functionality of the Related Verses Tool and Phrase Matching Tool to allow for cross-version and mulitple verse comparisons would be helpful. I'd love to see a souped up version of this that would be similar to Accordance's INFER command. This would allow for searches for allusions and quotations across corpora. Right now it can be done on a verse by verse basis, but it would be extremely helpful to be able to compare Isaiah 53 to the whole New Testament or Ezekiel with Revelation, or James with Sirach, etc.

One thing that would be great would be some way of setting up an über-index of allusions and intertextual connections that could cross corpora. An xrefs file that could work with biblical texts, Apostolic Fathers, Josephus, Philo, Pseudepigrapha, or any other corpus of material would be extremely helpful. The index could work with references within BW, but it could also point to references outside of BibleWorks (e.g. Talmud, Mishnah, Midrash, etc.). What would REALLY be interesting here would be some means of making this a 'community built' list of allusions where folks could 'vote' on connections in the index or submit new connections if they think they might be there.

A way of expanding the syntax of the External Links Manager would be helpful (for instance, being able to have some kind of array that would convert different characters [like what represents an accent mark, etc.] would be helpful for going from bwgrkl to CCAT for Perseus searches, etc., as would the ability to send Unicode Greek to the web). It would also be helpful to have some means of converting syntax regarding book, chapter or verse number to different sites. So that if Gen 1:1 is represented somewhere as 001.01.01 the ELM could handle it.

Finally I'd love to see the ability to create one's own lexicon. Currently we can create versions, we can create CHM modules, we can even tag CHM modules to work verse-by-verse in the Verse Tab, but it would amazing if we could crunch our own lexicons as well.

basilides
03-11-2013, 01:42 AM
Second that. Especially Muraoka's Greek English Lexicon to the Septuagint (2010: though very pricey, I'm afraid) which would be more than welcome (as an add-on or whatever), as would (and has this been mentioned before?) NETS: The New English Translation of the Septuagint.:p

MortenJensen
03-11-2013, 05:46 AM
Another suggestion: I would like to see the Leedy diagrams turned into a tab as well. I am really growing fund of the BW9-interface with its flexibility of dragging tabs around the two Analysis-windows. And I should like to see as much as possible turned into tabs so you can have it open permanently when browsing texts.

Morten

bkMitchell
03-11-2013, 08:03 AM
Second that. Especially Muraoka's Greek English Lexicon to the Septuagint (2010: though very pricey, I'm afraid) which would be more than welcome (as an add-on or whatever), as would (and has this been mentioned before?) NETS: The New English Translation of the Septuagint.:p
Well, seeing as the Aramaic Peshitta New Testament Database (APNT) is sold as a module maybe something could be worked out for the NETS, too.

basilides
03-11-2013, 09:48 AM
Well, seeing as the Aramaic Peshitta New Testament Database (APNT) is sold as a module maybe something could be worked out for the NETS, too.

Many BibleWorkers hope so. Then finally we can stop begging Mike B. to provide us with something BibleWorks should have offered years ago (i.e., THE NEW ENGLISH TRANSLATION OF THE SEPTUAGINT), among several other resources mentioned in this thread related to the LXX.

Donald Cobb
03-11-2013, 10:10 AM
One thing I would like to see in the next version of BibleWorks is a way of listing different forms automatically.

I'm doing a little looking right now on second aorist forms (is this the right way of saying it in English?). Take for example ἔρχομαι, 3d pers., plur.:

*ἦλθον: 444x
*ήλθοσαν: 17x
*ῆλθαν: 9x


As far as I know, there is no way of making BW spit out an automatic list like this (much less conduct a search for specific endings via a morphological search, i.e., in BGM rather than BGT). Lists of this kind can be useful for teaching and research, and it seems to me like an area that is not very developed in BW. Perhaps others might have come across this. I'd be interested in your feedback (and other examples!).

Actually the Usage Summary for BGM approaches this, but there seems to be no way of sorting out the data in it, or exporting it to a word processor. It's also limited to Biblical texts, if I'm not mistaken.

Don Cobb
Aix-en-Povence, France

DavidR
03-11-2013, 10:31 AM
Second that. Especially Muraoka's Greek English Lexicon to the Septuagint (2010: though very pricey, I'm afraid) which would be more than welcome (as an add-on or whatever), as would (and has this been mentioned before?) NETS: The New English Translation of the Septuagint.:p
It was mentioned just 6 posts previously to yours. That's what I mean about checking the thread before posting a suggestion. And about the thread having perhaps outlived its usefulness, since it's gotten too long for people to want to take time looking through it.

basilides
03-11-2013, 10:37 AM
I am well aware of that. Isn't that obvious. I was the one who keeps mentioning it, in the hope that the squeaky wheel will get the grease (hence the red in bold). Good grief!

DavidR
03-11-2013, 10:56 AM
Sorry, no offense meant. It was someone else who'd mentioned it in post #78. It's too bad this forum doesn't allow for polls (does it?), which would allow voting rather than multiple posting to make it clear how much a resource is desired.

MortenJensen
03-13-2013, 11:06 AM
I thing to consider: A root search-feature.
It is possible in Accordance, and I would like to use a feature like this from time to time. Like, when searching on everything that has to do with disciples and discipleship in Matthew - then you have to know that at least three words are in play (mathetes, manthano, matheteuo). A root search would in principal help you clarify certain topics better.

On the other hand, such a feature must be based on manual tagging and thus after all introduce a number of editorial decisions.

What do you think? Have you ever missed a root-search function?

Morten

MGVH
03-14-2013, 09:10 AM
What do you think? Have you ever missed a root-search function?
Morten
Yeah... See my blog post (http://bibleandtech.blogspot.com/2011/12/searching-for-greek-roots-in-accordance.html).

MortenJensen
03-14-2013, 10:01 AM
Thanks, then we are two of us. Should not be that difficult to implement, I guess.
I liked your post on LN-domains. The problem with these searches, though, is that they tend to be to wide-ranged. Try searching for mathethes in Matt, and you will get a whole lot other stuff as well.
Morten

DavidR
03-14-2013, 07:24 PM
I can see the usefulness of this, but I can see pitfalls as well, even if it were easy to implement. I fear it would tempt early-stage students in particular (and maybe some more experienced people as well) into the etymological fallacy. For instance, the fact that both παραθήκη and διαθήκη come from the root found in τίθημι is almost meaningless, since both the root and Greek prepositions are so wide-ranging in the derivatives that they can form. Yet given a powerful enough root search feature, I guarantee you that inside of a week you'd have people preaching sermons in which the "good deposit" of 2 Tim. 1:14 was getting linked to a theology of covenant on no viable linguistic grounds whatsoever.

Maybe a root-search feature ought to come with a warning label and a reference to James Barr's The Semantics of Biblical Language!

jdarlack
03-15-2013, 09:58 AM
Maybe a root-search feature ought to come with a warning label and a reference to James Barr's The Semantics of Biblical Language!You could say that about ALL BIBLE SOFTWARE TOOLS IN GENERAL!!! :) Uncle Ben's advice to Spidey applies to any such tool: "With great power comes great responsibility."

DavidR
03-15-2013, 12:14 PM
You could say that about ALL BIBLE SOFTWARE TOOLS IN GENERAL!!! :) Uncle Ben's advice to Spidey applies to any such tool: "With great power comes great responsibility."
Yes, absolutely. That's the advantage of studying languages and exegesis in a seminary or other educational context. The wonderful ability to learn these things independently that's available today has the downside of providing less context and less mentoring for the learner.

jimofbentley
03-15-2013, 08:38 PM
I thing to consider: A root search-feature.
It is possible in Accordance, and I would like to use a feature like this from time to time. Like, when searching on everything that has to do with disciples and discipleship in Matthew - then you have to know that at least three words are in play (mathetes, manthano, matheteuo). A root search would in principal help you clarify certain topics better.

On the other hand, such a feature must be based on manual tagging and thus after all introduce a number of editorial decisions.

What do you think? Have you ever missed a root-search function?

Morten

It would be helpful, at times, but couldn't you do the same thing by using the Graphical Search Engine? It would take a little longer, as you would have to set up the search parameters yourself, but it could easily be done.

MortenJensen
03-16-2013, 04:25 AM
I don't think so. How will you do that?

Morten

basilides
03-18-2013, 09:33 PM
Granted, this thread is getting long in the tooth, but what the heck!

This isn't already possible to do in BibleWorks 9.0, is it? If so, I haven't been paying attention.

It would be nice to have the ability to create (via, say, the VDC) an English interlinear to say the BGM or BNM in the Interlinear Mode (4 rows in columns), editable on the fly.

Please spare us the pedantic lectures on how interlinears stifle language learning. We lesser mortals sometimes need such crutches.

P.s.: I apologize for mentioning NETS (The New English Translation of the Septuagint) so often in this thread.;) It would make a nice BibleWorks 10.0 module, though. Emptor decernit.

jimofbentley
03-19-2013, 04:47 AM
I thing to consider: A root search-feature.
It is possible in Accordance, and I would like to use a feature like this from time to time. Like, when searching on everything that has to do with disciples and discipleship in Matthew - then you have to know that at least three words are in play (mathetes, manthano, matheteuo). A root search would in principal help you clarify certain topics better.

On the other hand, such a feature must be based on manual tagging and thus after all introduce a number of editorial decisions.

What do you think? Have you ever missed a root-search function?

Morten


It would be helpful, at times, but couldn't you do the same thing by using the Graphical Search Engine? It would take a little longer, as you would have to set up the search parameters yourself, but it could easily be done.


I don't think so. How will you do that?

Morten

I can set up the GSE, but I don't know how to display it here.

However, a simple "or" search:

/μαθητευω μανθανω καταμανθανω μαθητης μαθητρια συμμαθητης αμαθης

would turn up all of the roots having to do with "discipleship".

For this, I used Trenchard's Complete Vocabulary Guide to the Greek New Testament, under the "Cognate Word Groups" section.

anopcfox
03-19-2013, 11:50 AM
I like most of what I see in the discussion, though I am not a manuscript expert.

1. I would like to see a more formal editor, with some of the ability that Word and Wperfect have to format.
2. Want to see Confessions set up like Bible Texts--Bold references (e.g WCF 1:3) along with a full set of 3 Forms of Unity
3. More clarity on what each tab does, and less confusion as to where to find the tabs I want.

Even If Ministries
03-19-2013, 12:01 PM
BibleWorks Manuscript Project: How about a digitized septuagint to go with the New Testament? How about digitizing the Hebrew texts of the Old Testament as well?

interaction with wordsearch modules - keep this!

Awesome so far - would be untoucable with the above added to the manuscript project!

andley
03-19-2013, 06:34 PM
unicode for all modules !!

bobvenem
03-27-2013, 05:06 PM
I would like BW10 to color highlight bracketed textual variants in the various Greek texts whenever I'm doing text comparisons. I've been building a variant database, and have missed numerous bracketed variants because they are not highlighted.

Unless, of course, there's some way to do it that I am missing (happens a lot with BW!).

Jim Wert
03-27-2013, 09:59 PM
I would like BW10 to color highlight bracketed textual variants in the various Greek texts whenever I'm doing text comparisons. I've been building a variant database, and have missed numerous bracketed variants because they are not highlighted.

Unless, of course, there's some way to do it that I am missing (happens a lot with BW!).

This thread http://www.bibleworks.com/forums/showthread.php?5445-Search-for-quot-quot-in-GNT&highlight=brackets discussed how to find the brackets.

I know of no automatic way to construct a colour file for all bracketed words/phrases in a given Greek version; it could be done manually by someone obsessive-compulsive enough.

I would suggest that making the bracketed text easily findable (and therefore high-lightable) in BW would be a very nice touch. In WTM information on textual notes is included in the morphological tags (and therefore searchable). Maybe something similar would be possible for Greek versions.

bobvenem
03-29-2013, 12:13 PM
Thanks, Jim. I followed that thread a while back, and downloaded the GNT as an rtf file as suggested by Michael. However, I discovered that manually scanning the text in BW was faster for what I'm doing.

Here's hoping BW can add something to bring this feature on board.

Donald Cobb
04-22-2013, 05:41 AM
One thing I would like to see in the next version of BibleWorks is a way of listing different forms automatically.

I'm doing a little looking right now on second aorist forms (is this the right way of saying it in English?). Take for example ἔρχομαι, 3d pers., plur.:

*ἦλθον: 444x
*ήλθοσαν: 17x
*ῆλθαν: 9x


As far as I know, there is no way of making BW spit out an automatic list like this (much less conduct a search for specific endings via a morphological search, i.e., in BGM rather than BGT). Lists of this kind can be useful for teaching and research, and it seems to me like an area that is not very developed in BW. Perhaps others might have come across this. I'd be interested in your feedback (and other examples!).

Actually the Usage Summary for BGM approaches this, but there seems to be no way of sorting out the data in it, or exporting it to a word processor. It's also limited to Biblical texts, if I'm not mistaken.

Don Cobb
Aix-en-Povence, France

Hello all,

1. I made the above suggestion some time ago, but it was never picked up on. I'm thinking it's because it came between two posts on the NETS Bible (remember that?!!!). I'd be interested in knowing if any one else sees the usefulness of the idea.

One thing that strikes me is that the list-making capability in BW seems to be solely focused on verses, i.e., I can make a list of where certain verb or nouns are found, but it doesn't seem like I can compile a list of the forms themselves, that can then be sorted by frequency, etc. Another example : in one forum I follow, I found this:


qryVerbPersonNumberDistribution Query
Person/Number
Count


1P
870


1S
2069


2P
2059


2S
1416


3P
3322


3S
9426



I don't think this can be done in BW9. It would be a nice feature! Something like this can actually be done with the lemma/form usage statistics in the analysis pane, but I have yet to find a way of exporting the results.

2. Along the same lines, it would be nice to be able to compile, for instance, a list of aorist passive verbs that have a -θ ending (i.e., ἐλύθην, etc., as opposed to, say, Ao2 non sigmatic verbs, e.g., ἐσπάρην). This would require filtering and ordering both the data in the morphological versions, as well as the forms in the text versions. But it would be a nice feature!

3. It would also be nice to be able to export all this in some eye-pleasing format.

4. I read this morning the complaints registered about not being able to use unicode, and the responses given there. From what I understand, the non unicode internal language (if I'm not expressing myself too poorly) is one of the reasons for the speed in BW searches. There is one valid point in the remarks made, however, and that it that it's not currently possible to paste unicode texts into the search window in order to search on a root, a form or a string. In working with other resources, this would be a a helpful feature, IMO.

5. I would love to see a punctuated version of the LXX, Apostolic Fathers, and other Greek texts! It's not so difficult to get used to when actually reading the texts, but when doing string or (especially) syntax searches, there are often times when the punctuation affects the query.

6. It would also be nice to envision tie-ins with TLG and PHI texts. This would be really helpful in searching on forms outside of those texts that are in the BW9 version (same language searches).

7. A minor quibble. I know that aesthetics is a minor issue in the grand scheme. But it would be nice if the overall presentation of BW were improved. The button bar is already a step in the right direction. But one of my students looked at my setup a while ago (a non BW user) and quipped: "When will BW stop looking like a DOS program?" The Mac Beta version is even less appealing, visually. Along these same lines, harmonizing the different formats that are used would be nice. It seems like there is one for "Daily light", one for the CHM (?) documents (grammars, etc.), one for the brows window, one for the KWIK reports, etc. That gives the overall impression of an amateurish presentation.

I know this thread has gone on for quite a while, and perhaps I'm trying to flog a dead horse, but the suggestions here have been on my mind for a while. I also want to reiterate my thanks to the BW staff for the great--and selfless--work they do. I have a great appreciation for you folks!

Don Cobb
Aix-en-Provence, France

Polycarp
05-04-2013, 07:48 AM
I would like to see Clines's Dictionary of Classical Hebrew & Muraoka's Greek-English Lexicon of the Septuagint in BW10.

dnns
05-15-2013, 09:56 AM
I would be happy to see a better note taking system with an option to display note directory tree similar to something like this:

1116

benelchi
05-16-2013, 08:36 PM
1) I would love to be able to type complex searches in the command line in Hebrew and Greek while using the Native Hebrew and Greek keyboards. In version 9 most of the Hebrew entry bugs were fixed but I am still unable to @* etc... while using a Hebrew keyboard. After entering the . or ' the Hebrew characters work, but the special code characters cannot be typed. This is a very old but that I hope will someday be come a priority to fix.

2) I would love to see an OT manuscript addition similar to the NT addition that came out in version 9.

3) I would love to see Hebrew versions of Jewish writings (like the Mishah) in the databases.

doslidnyk
05-17-2013, 10:31 AM
What about the ability of grouping Bible versions in the Browse Window? For example, one group would be the Original Languages, another one - English translations, still another one - Vernacular translations (Polish, Russian, German etc.). Then the group could either be expanded/collapsed with a click or one would pick a desired group from a dropdown menu. Might be quicker to navigate, rather than scrolling through dozens of translations. Thanks for considering.

DavidR
05-17-2013, 10:51 AM
I like that idea. And how about this as an expansion of it: hover the mouse pointer over a collapsed group, and the translations in that group appear in a popup window for a quick view of them.

Mark Eddy
05-18-2013, 12:33 AM
What about the ability of grouping Bible versions in the Browse Window? For example, one group would be the Original Languages, another one - English translations, still another one - Vernacular translations (Polish, Russian, German etc.). Then the group could either be expanded/collapsed with a click or one would pick a desired group from a dropdown menu. Might be quicker to navigate, rather than scrolling through dozens of translations. Thanks for considering.

Some of us have been doing this very thing for years (BW8, if not BW7). Just use the tabs. One tab for your Greek NT versions, another for the Hebrew OT, another for English translations, and you have 9 more tabs for other combinations. In BW9 you can label the tabs, so you don't forget which is which. And if you should run out of tabs, you can always set up some "Favorites" in the BW Options Window, and you can switch between favorites in the same tab in just a couple clicks, and stay in the same Bible verse. Mark Eddy P.S. is anyone else having a problem using the "Enter" key to start a new paragraph here? I can't get it to work, as you can see from this post, which should be 3 separate paragraphs.

Donald Cobb
05-18-2013, 08:04 AM
Things I would like to see improved in the presentation (some of these have already been mentioned by others):

- I can't comment on how BW9 looks in Windows 7 or 8, but in XP (especially under Parallels in Mac), the Greek font is very thin and not very enjoyable for reading. With the Mac Crossover version, it doesn't come across well either. Of the different fonts, bwgkl is the best, but it still could be improved. I would love to see a font that is better adapted for reading long passages. If it is acceptable as is in Windows 7 and 8, then at least a better font for Mac users would be appreciated!

- As I've already mentioned, with a reading mode that puts verses into paragraphs would be very appreciated. Along with that suggestion, I would suggest adding a space separating paragraphs as well. The current paragraph marker is helpful when working with texts, but not really when just reading.

- Again, when in browse mode, the text in BGT, etc. is very tight from one line to the next. If there were a way of setting it up (only in browse mode!) to make a larger line space, that would be helpful.

- In the verse list, I like the feature of being able to see the entire verse, and not just one line of it ("show entire verse"); however, there is currently no spacing between the references, so they look like they run together. It would nice to have each verse separated by a space.

All these comments are connected, I think, with the fact that other Bible programs (Logos, Accordance) have gotten on board with the idea that a Bible program is no longer just for researching words or verses; it's also for actual reading. BW is not geared toward that use, at least for the moment, but it would be helpful for it to do so!

BTW, I second DNS's suggestion of having an easier way of finding notes.

Don Cobb
Aix-en-Provence, France

DavidR
05-19-2013, 10:25 PM
Some of us have been doing this very thing for years (BW8, if not BW7). Just use the tabs. One tab for your Greek NT versions, another for the Hebrew OT, another for English translations, and you have 9 more tabs for other combinations. In BW9 you can label the tabs, so you don't forget which is which. And if you should run out of tabs, you can always set up some "Favorites" in the BW Options Window, and you can switch between favorites in the same tab in just a couple clicks, and stay in the same Bible verse.
I do use tabs, for instance, when writing a sermon based on the week's lectionary texts, I have a tab for searching, and one tab each for the OT text, Psalm, Epistle, and Gospel. But in each of those tabs I have multiple versions in multiple languages (my most commonly used Favorite has NRS, NIV, WTT, BGT, VUL, PEH, not all of which, of course, appear in every context). Being able to have the English or other versions grouped so as to collapse and expand them would still be useful.

Dale A. Brueggemann
05-20-2013, 05:03 AM
What about the ability of grouping Bible versions in the Browse Window?

I like this idea of grouping the the versions in the browse window.

frankenfro
06-03-2013, 12:25 PM
Hello all,

One thing that strikes me is that the list-making capability in BW seems to be solely focused on verses, i.e., I can make a list of where certain verb or nouns are found, but it doesn't seem like I can compile a list of the forms themselves, that can then be sorted by frequency, etc. Don Cobb
Aix-en-Provence, France

I would love to see more lexical statistics too. I posted something similar to this on 5/31/13 - http://www.bibleworks.com/forums/showthread.php?5677-Hebrew-Stem-Stats

I want to count the number of times that a Hebrew verb is used in Qal, Niphal, Piel, Pual, etc. For instance, I'm looking at "aman" (to trust, believe) in Gen 15:6 - I want to see how many times that it's used in each stem.

Doing it manually yields -

Qal - 8x
Niph - 46x
Hiph - 51x

But this is me doing several different searches and recording the stats on my own - aman in qal; aman in niphal; aman in piel, etc. I'd much rather run one search and then be able to filter it as I'd like.

Jim Wert
06-04-2013, 12:04 AM
I would love to see more lexical statistics too. I posted something similar to this on 5/31/13 - http://www.bibleworks.com/forums/showthread.php?5677-Hebrew-Stem-Stats

I want to count the number of times that a Hebrew verb is used in Qal, Niphal, Piel, Pual, etc. For instance, I'm looking at "aman" (to trust, believe) in Gen 15:6 - I want to see how many times that it's used in each stem.

Doing it manually yields -

Qal - 8x
Niph - 46x
Hiph - 51x

But this is me doing several different searches and recording the stats on my own - aman in qal; aman in niphal; aman in piel, etc. I'd much rather run one search and then be able to filter it as I'd like.
If I understand your request, BibleWorks did satisfy it in BW8 and BW9. The thread you link to explains how to do it using the Word List Manager.
It took me a few minutes to figure out the required settings for the WLM, but then it is very easy to use.

Tom Huntford
08-04-2013, 03:13 AM
1. Copy-paste Greek to Microsoft Word, using the Mcrosoft Symbol Font. Wouldn't matter if accents came through.

2. In at least one English version (KJV), one Hebrew, and one Greek, mark the Old Testament Quotations in the New Testament. Mark them in BOTH the Old and New Testaments. Only the part actually quoted, like "Out of Egypt I called my son" in Hosea 11. And make them either a link to each other, or else you hover over them and the "other end of the quotation" pops up. Absolutely the FIRST place everyone should start with "exegesis"! :rolleyes:

SteveO
08-05-2013, 12:52 AM
Would love to see more native/built-in support to use OneNote as a notetaker/resources collector for study.
Windows Phone 8 app :p


DISCLAIMER: I am a full-time employee at the MSFT corp. in the Office division. That said, I don't think I'm alone in wanting to use OneNote with BW.

-sdo

MGVH
08-05-2013, 09:37 AM
1. Copy-paste Greek to Microsoft Word, using the Mcrosoft Symbol Font. Wouldn't matter if accents came through.
Given the widespread availability of Unicode fonts, I don't think there are many people in the world that want the Greek in MS Symbol Font. If you want it, just create your own Greek NT. Start w/ the transliterated version (GRT) or get the original CCAT text and use find/replace in MS Word to create the text you want. (My point is that I think the BW people should be spending their time on other stuff than this.)


2. In at least one English version (KJV), one Hebrew, and one Greek, mark the Old Testament Quotations in the New Testament. Mark them in BOTH the Old and New Testaments. Only the part actually quoted, like "Out of Egypt I called my son" in Hosea 11. And make them either a link to each other, or else you hover over them and the "other end of the quotation" pops up. Absolutely the FIRST place everyone should start with "exegesis"! :rolleyes:

This is a very difficult thing you are asking for. Do you want quotations? What about allusions? How many words constitute a quotation? Should it be a quote of the LXX? What if it is not an exact quote of the LXX? Or is it an alternative translation into Greek from the Hebrew? Or from the Targum? Or what if it is in some mss of the Greek NT but not all?
We actually already have most of the info needed by looking at the TSK in the X-Refs which will give you quotes and allusions and more. The NET Bible notes and the ESV Study Bible notes are also very good for highlighting quotations and references to the OT.

If you want a book, I'd suggest Carson and Beale's Commentary on the New Testament Use of the Old Testament.

Hugh
08-14-2013, 06:35 PM
I use Linux for 95% of my computing. BibleWorks is one of only 3 Windows programs that I use. I've tried BibleWorks with Wine, Crossover, and VirtualBox. All are unsatisfactory for one reason or another. What is really needed is a native Linux version. Now that there is a Mac version, it shouldn't be that hard since Linux and OSX are both based on Unix.

benelchi
08-15-2013, 10:56 AM
Hebrew

In the non-vocalized Hebrew texts (Dead Sea Scrolls principally, but also the Samaritan Pentateuch in the user-built module), the שׁ (= v) and the שׂ (= f) are represented by a third letter (ש = X). This means that these texts will be eliminated from same language searches, and also come up as variants when using the Text Comparison Settings. It would be nice to harmonize all this!

Also, this may be asking for the moon, but in same language searches, I believe that the mater lectionis readings (in Qumran for example) do not show up in string searches when there are differences on that level with WTT. It would be nice to have a greater coherence between these modules (I believe it's possible to get around this by using WTM as base version, though, if I remember correctly some previous searches).

How about morphologically tagged Hebrew text of some of the important talmudic ressources?

I would love to see some improvement in the lexicons for the Targums, as well as vocalized texts for more of these than are currently available (i.e., only one for the moment).

Any chance of getting some tagged manuscript facsimiles for some of the Dead Sea Scrolls (either Biblical texts or sectarian works)?



Additionally:

I would like to see the Hebrew biblical texts from the DSS incorporated into Bibleworks w/ or w/o morphology.

I am always hoping that the command line interface can someday be fixed so that you can use all of the search codes with Hebrew on the command line (when using the Israeli Hebrew keyboard). It would be nice to not always have to resort to the graphics search Engine.

acheung
08-24-2013, 11:37 PM
a portable version on ipad will be nice (even if it is with reduced functionality).

Donald Cobb
08-26-2013, 11:59 AM
One more thing (on my wish list!). In doing comparative word studies, I realized recently that it's not possible to group together multiple resources for word searches, at least not as far as I can see. It would be VERY helpful, for instance, to be able to search on a word or phrase in both BGM and Philo (PHM)--or, better yet, to be able to search on books/passages of BGM and specific books/passages of Philo--at the same time. Along with this, to have both resources integrated into the "use" pane would be WONDERFUL!

This would allow one to see how and where a word from the NT or LXX is used in other non biblical works, especially helpful in works like Philo's De praemiis et poenis, De exsecrationibus (PEP), where Philo paraphrases the Biblical text without ever specifying what passage he is citing.

Of course, it's now possible to search on all same language versions, which is a great feature, but that can become pretty tedious if you are working on specific collections.

Along these same lines, it would helpful to set the "use" pane to respect book limits as can be done with the search pane.

Don Cobb
Aix-en-Provence, France

jfidel
08-26-2013, 06:28 PM
I suggest you try going to the menu and selecting search/cross search mode and then selecting search all same language versions. There are 3 different options available. This will allow you to search on a Greek word or lemma across all Greek resources.

Does this accomplish your request?

Donald Cobb
08-27-2013, 01:49 AM
I suggest you try going to the menu and selecting search/cross search mode and then selecting search all same language versions. There are 3 different options available. This will allow you to search on a Greek word or lemma across all Greek resources.

Does this accomplish your request?

Yes, I'm familiar with the cross version search mode and use it regularly. It's great for seeing where and how a word is used anywhere in the collections contained. But, it's too unwieldy for doing a comparison between only two collections or two books in separate collections, as each search goes through each and every collection of Greek (or English, or...) texts. Now, there could be something I'm missing; I usually use the "Search and prune all same language versions" function. I don't really use the "Search all same language display versions" since I don't see any substantial difference between that and an ordinary search.

At any rate, what would be helpful would be something in between a simple search in BGM for instance, and the full blown search, with a way of combining different collections or sections of different collections, and instantly seeing the results in the "use" panel.

Don Cobb

christlove
08-27-2013, 03:40 AM
One more thing (on my wish list!). In doing comparative word studies, I realized recently that it's not possible to group together multiple resources for word searches, at least not as far as I can see. It would be VERY helpful, for instance, to be able to search on a word or phrase in both BGM and Philo (PHM)--or, better yet, to be able to search on books/passages of BGM and specific books/passages of Philo--at the same time. Along with this, to have both resources integrated into the "use" pane would be WONDERFUL!

This would allow one to see how and where a word from the NT or LXX is used in other non biblical works, especially helpful in works like Philo's De praemiis et poenis, De exsecrationibus (PEP), where Philo paraphrases the Biblical text without ever specifying what passage he is citing.

Of course, it's now possible to search on all same language versions, which is a great feature, but that can become pretty tedious if you are working on specific collections.

Along these same lines, it would helpful to set the "use" pane to respect book limits as can be done with the search pane.

Don Cobb
Aix-en-Provence, France

How about setting new "favorites", say BGM and Philo and then search "Search all same language display versions"? That gets a bit more structure into your search results...

Blessings,
Steffen

Donald Cobb
08-27-2013, 05:57 AM
How about setting new "favorites", say BGM and Philo and then search "Search all same language display versions"? That gets a bit more structure into your search results...

Blessings,
Steffen

Dear Steffen,

Perhaps you could give me some pointers on how you get that to work? I can either get the cross version search so that only the search version shows up (e.g., BGM, etc.) or so that every Greek collection in BW is searched. I haven't been able to find a way to perform a search on BGM et PHM only and simultaneously.

Don Cobb

christlove
08-27-2013, 07:22 AM
Dear Steffen,

Perhaps you could give me some pointers on how you get that to work? I can either get the cross version search so that only the search version shows up (e.g., BGM, etc.) or so that every Greek collection in BW is searched. I haven't been able to find a way to perform a search on BGM et PHM only and simultaneously.

Don Cobb

Click on the big dropdown-button right underneath the command line and then choose "edit search/display favorites". Then click on the "Add"-Button next to the "search and display favorites"-window. Then double-click on "display 01". Now you can add and remove the display versions as you wish. After that you can rename your "display 01"-list into for instance "BGM-Philo". After that if you click on the dropdown-button underneath the CL you will see the name of your just created "display favorite versions". You might also want to create a similar list with all the versions you usually wish to display. Do the same and save the list and you can switch easily from one display version-list to the other in an instant.

I know, that´s only a little approach for your specific request. Searching for specific passages in one book and specific passages in the other at the same time isn´t possible till now as far as I know.

Hope that helps.
Steffen

Donald Cobb
08-27-2013, 08:54 AM
Click on the big dropdown-button right underneath the command line and then choose "edit search/display favorites". Then click on the "Add"-Button next to the "search and display favorites"-window. Then double-click on "display 01". Now you can add and remove the display versions as you wish. After that you can rename your "display 01"-list into for instance "BGM-Philo". After that if you click on the dropdown-button underneath the CL you will see the name of your just created "display favorite versions". You might also want to create a similar list with all the versions you usually wish to display. Do the same and save the list and you can switch easily from one display version-list to the other in an instant.

I know, that´s only a little approach for your specific request. Searching for specific passages in one book and specific passages in the other at the same time isn´t possible till now as far as I know.

Hope that helps.
Steffen

Ok, got it Steffen. Thanks. It is still something I think could be made easier for a future version (especially with the use pane!).

Blessings,

Don

christlove
08-27-2013, 09:12 AM
It is still something I think could be made easier for a future version (especially with the use pane!).

I appreciate your suggest and totally aggree besides to get a feature like that in the future....

Have an nice day.
Steffen

philo
09-13-2013, 05:18 PM
What I want to see in version 10?
1. Make BW more intuitive!!!!!! (I have to keep remembering how to do basic things.)
2. More control over the display of the main interface.

Adjustable font sizes
Adjustable browse window display of a block of text in continuous format (without CRLF line breaks) eg. Acts 1:1-9
Ability to integrate the PopUp Browse Window side-by-side with the Main Browse Window so that I can have two of them side by side: a MAIN browse window, and the "PopUP" window. (I want to be able to keep a main text open at all times without having searches change the window, AND without having a PopUp cover part of the other windows.)


Enough for now.

Gary

Lee
09-13-2013, 09:31 PM
What I want to see in version 10?
2. More control over the display of the main interface.

Adjustable font sizes



You can adjust font sizes. Click on the wrench in the toolbar, and then click on "Fonts." You then have the opportunity to finagle the fonts however you see fit.

Of course, you do have to restart BW to implement the font size changes--perhaps that is what you mean?

Chas
09-15-2013, 01:58 AM
I would like to see the ability to do a text comparison oftwo different passages. This would include text from the Church Father and textfrom the Scriptures, or two different passages of Scripture such as acomparison of the NT quote of the LXX. I would also like to switch betweenlexicons without having to go back into the browse window.
chas

philo
09-20-2013, 05:02 AM
You can adjust font sizes. Click on the wrench in the toolbar, and then click on "Fonts." You then have the opportunity to finagle the fonts however you see fit.

Of course, you do have to restart BW to implement the font size changes--perhaps that is what you mean?

Thanks for the reply. And you're right, I was not clear enough. Right now, adjusting font sizes is like having a 4 wheel drive that you have to stop, get out, turn the wheel hubs, and get back in to drive. I'd like to be able to adjust on the spot with the click of a button . . . like in MS Word.

Thanks,
Gary

SkipB
09-20-2013, 07:47 AM
In a classroom setting I often need to adjust the font size in the browse window. I have found (and this is clearly not the intended way to do this) that after changing fonts from the menu, if I ignore the advise to restart I can usually implement the new font size by simply clicking on the browse mode toggle icon (two little feet). Clicking twice brings me back to where I was with the new font size displayed. Since at this point I am usually just projecting the text from a secondary browse window, any instability this short cut may produce goes unnoticed. Also I have no problems displaying a range of text as a single block in either browse mode. You just need to remember that if you try to move with an up or down arrow on the slider bar you will revert to a single verse.

philo
09-20-2013, 10:28 AM
In a classroom setting I often need to adjust the font size in the browse window. I have found (and this is clearly not the intended way to do this) that after changing fonts from the menu, if I ignore the advise to restart I can usually implement the new font size by simply clicking on the browse mode toggle icon (two little feet). Clicking twice brings me back to where I was with the new font size displayed. Since at this point I am usually just projecting the text from a secondary browse window, any instability this short cut may produce goes unnoticed. Also I have no problems displaying a range of text as a single block in either browse mode. You just need to remember that if you try to move with an up or down arrow on the slider bar you will revert to a single verse.

Font Change: Beutimous!

Block of text: Ok, I got it back again after messing around for 30 minutes, but I don't know how. No matter which browse mode I used, a "running block" was not working at all for that last several weeks. Obviously, I'm doing something wrong, but I don't know what. But as of now, when I toggle browse off (i.e., the bottom browse button goes light), I can get a range of text to show in a running block (just as before, and just as I want).

Thanks,
Gary

dbielby
09-24-2013, 10:12 AM
I think it might be helpful to expand the vocabulary flashcard module in two directions.

1) Offer the language study paradigms (for example, offer the Greek paradigms so that we can practice studying the various forms). Offer this by language and by grammar (most popular ones).

2) Go after the Chinese market and other modern language markets by offering two things.
A) Study the scriptures using the flashcard module. So any student who is learning a foreign language and wants to study the Bible, can easily do so in BibleWorks by configuring the flashcard module to include whatever language they are studying and the words for a range of verses (as you can do in Greek and Hebrew right now). Include audio files with pronunciation. So if my child is learning Spanish or Chinese in school we can share flash card stacks with them from a passage of scripture by quickly going into BibleWorks. Or if we are learning a new language (modern) we can do the same for ourselves.
Integrate this into Android apps so we can study on our smart phones.

B) For languages like Chinese, upgrade the software to intuitively recognize which characters are clumped together to form a word in the text. Just like
letters in English are clumped into their individual words, put the characters together (at least behind the scenes) so that when a 'word' is clicked on, all the characters for that word highlight automatically. This is especially helpful for anyone learning a language. And for Chinese (Mandarin) you should offer standard Pinyin as well with accent marks so that people who cannot read very well can identify characters or pronounce them by reading the Pinyin. (Everyone learning Chinese knows that).

dbielby
09-24-2013, 10:22 AM
I have a Galaxy Note II smart phone that has a great screen. I would really like to see the flashcard part of BW offer an app that runs on smart phones and tabs. That could even be a way for BW to gather new users! Especially if it is integrated into modern language grammars. For example, someone studying English from another nation, could use the ESV Biblical Text and focus on certain passages (learning the meanings of words and how to pronounce them). This could enable foreigners who know the passage of the Bible their church is working through to study in advance. Same thing for Americans learning a foreign language. We could study a certain passage in that language and get a jump in preparing for a meeting or talk. There are many uses for this, but in essence it opens up Bible Study for a myriad of directions.

dbielby
09-24-2013, 03:21 PM
You know how we can filter the Greek words based on chapters in BBG2? Could we get that for Page Kelley's Hebrew grammar or BBH by Pratico and Van Pelt? And could we get them with modern Hebrew pronunciations of the words instead of the pronunciations included in BBH's audio files? That would be a really nice addition.

oecolampadius
10-03-2013, 05:10 AM
I would love to see global forward and backward buttons added. It doesn't seem that every verse viewed is added to the verse list, and then, the verse list itself is a little bit buried in the menu.

Mark Eddy
10-03-2013, 04:58 PM
I am not sure what you mean by "global forward and backward buttons," but in BW9 over the command line, to the right of the twelve tabs are buttons to go backward or forward through the verses you just looked up.
The verse history keeps 100 verses, so if you looked up a verse 99 verses ago, it will not add it to the list. Perhaps the functionality could be changed to put that verse at the top of the list, but I suppose that having the program scan the verse history list that way would certainly complicate this feature, but it might make it more useful for the user.
Also, the Verse History can be added to the button bar, so that you do not have to look through a menu to find it.
Mark Eddy

dsmohler
10-05-2013, 04:29 PM
In my opinion, the single-most missing feature in all BibleWorks editions is the ability to select from results of the search list using the keyboard.

I can press F2, type my search, scroll the list and then ... I have to reach for my mouse. Why not right arrow to select, or Alt+Space, or Ctrl+Enter or something?

Glenn Weaver
10-07-2013, 08:16 AM
Hi dsmohler,

The keyboard ability that you request is already present in BibleWorks. After you conduct your search, press the F5 key to select the first entry in your search results list. Then you can use the down arrow to move down the search results list, or you can use the right arrow to move down the list and display the newly-highlight search result. It works very well, and has become one of my new favorite shortcuts.

Blessings,
Glenn

oecolampadius
10-07-2013, 01:03 PM
I am not sure what you mean by "global forward and backward buttons," but in BW9 over the command line, to the right of the twelve tabs are buttons to go backward or forward through the verses you just looked up.
The verse history keeps 100 verses, so if you looked up a verse 99 verses ago, it will not add it to the list. Perhaps the functionality could be changed to put that verse at the top of the list, but I suppose that having the program scan the verse history list that way would certainly complicate this feature, but it might make it more useful for the user.
Also, the Verse History can be added to the button bar, so that you do not have to look through a menu to find it.
Mark Eddy

Hi Mark,

The problem I find is that the "Search Window History" forward and backward buttons don't recall every verse browsed to, but rather only those which have been clicked on in the search window. For instance, I search for a given Hebrew word, get the results, click on a result in the list, I am taken to that verse and that verse is added to the verse history. But if I then go up and browse manually to a different reference, that reference is not added to the verse list. The verse list seems only to add a verse that's been accessed via the search window and not if browsed to manually. So, since the forward and backward buttons are already in place, I guess the change I'm proposing is that the verse list also add verses that have been browsed to manually. Does that make some sense?

A separate suggestion, I would like to see the book names (displayed in the window and in copy & paste references) match the version to which they belong. So, if the version is French, have the book name in French rather than English; same for Hebrew and Greek.

MGVH
10-08-2013, 12:25 AM
In my opinion, the single-most missing feature in all BibleWorks editions is the ability to select from results of the search list using the keyboard.

I can press F2, type my search, scroll the list and then ... I have to reach for my mouse. Why not right arrow to select, or Alt+Space, or Ctrl+Enter or something?

You saw Glenn's reply for doing it all via keyboard.
Conversely, I run the search, click the mouse anywhere in the Browse window, then I use CTRL + the wheel on my mouse to move through results and have them show up.
(Use CTRL-SHIFT and the mouse wheel to move forward/back a verse at a time.)

christlove
10-08-2013, 02:20 AM
Conversely, I run the search, click the mouse anywhere in the Browse window, then I use CTRL + the wheel on my mouse to move through results and have them show up.
(Use CTRL-SHIFT and the mouse wheel to move forward/back a verse at a time.)

Well, that works good for me. Does a shortcut like that also exist for the search window? To just scroll from one verse to another?

Blessings,
Steffen

Glenn Weaver
10-09-2013, 08:28 AM
Hi Steffen,

The Ctrl + mouse wheel and Ctrl + Shift + mouse wheel works in the Search Window, as well. Ctrl + wheel moves up and down the search results, and Ctrl + Shift + wheel moves one verse at a time.

The keyboard down arrows and the left/right arrows also move through the search hits in the Search Window.

Blessings,
Glenn

jdarlack
10-09-2013, 11:45 AM
Font Size adjustment has already been mentioned here. I have a few suggestions though.

1. Standard web browsers have the ability to use the Ctrl key to increase and decrease font size on the fly:

Ctrl + (actually, Ctrl =) increases font size
Ctrl - decreases font size
Ctrl 0 (zero) returns font size to default browser setting

It would be handy to see this implemented in BW, so that font size could be expanded on the fly in whatever window is in 'focus'. At present, this works for CHM modules (as a factor of Help File functionalities). It does not work for lexicons, however.

2. Font Size adjustment for the ENTIRE interface (including toolbars, pop-ups, status bar, etc.). This can be accomplished in Windows globally, but it might be good to have some kind of font size change that would be global for BW in general.

3. Comic Sans Greek font.
Just kidding.

The font issue is not a matter of convenience, it is a matter of 'accessibility' for those with limited eyesight.

christlove
10-10-2013, 02:10 AM
The Ctrl + mouse wheel and Ctrl + Shift + mouse wheel works in the Search Window, as well. Ctrl + wheel moves up and down the search results, and Ctrl + Shift + wheel moves one verse at a time.

The keyboard down arrows and the left/right arrows also move through the search hits in the Search Window.

Hi Glenn,

indeed it works. I thought I tried it already yesterday and it didn´t work but now - awesome.
Thx a lot.

Blessings,
Steffen

klapehau
11-05-2013, 09:37 AM
It would be a fine thing: I select a word in my language version and it immediately appears that word in Hebrew or Greek.
God bless you,
Peter

Polycarp
11-08-2013, 03:07 PM
The BW product cycle would suggest that we're approaching a release of BW10. Any thoughts?

jdarlack
11-08-2013, 03:38 PM
The BW product cycle would suggest that we're approaching a release of BW10. Any thoughts?We're also approaching the eschaton! :)

Michael Hanel
11-08-2013, 06:44 PM
The BW product cycle would suggest that we're approaching a release of BW10. Any thoughts?

You must have some insider knowledge others don't. I've been using BW since version 7 and there has been no consistent fixed release cycle. We do know there will be a BW10 at some time since Mike B. has already leaked some details of what he's working on for it, but there's no reason to think that there is an imminent release. A good time to release would be around SBL cycles because that gives them a great opportunity to reach a large customer base with great info about the next version. If there were a release imminent, you would hear about it because SBL is coming up in a matter of weeks.

doc_dave
11-12-2013, 03:48 AM
unicode for all modules !!


Please please, at least Unicode for the 'transliteration' modules! But yes, ALL modules ideally.

Thank you. :)

Dan Phillips
11-12-2013, 09:37 AM
...I've been using BW since version 7...

Welcome, n00b!

(c;

Michael Hanel
11-12-2013, 11:42 AM
Welcome, n00b!

(c;


Not that it will change your assessment much (for I am much your junior, despite my leaky memory :cool:), but as I thought about it more I realized I misspoke. My first BW version was 5. I got it when I started Greek and Hebrew in college. My how time flies.

Dan Phillips
11-12-2013, 01:37 PM
Mm, so that's harder. I think​ I started with 4, but not certain.

DanDan
11-16-2013, 07:23 PM
You must have some insider knowledge others don't. I've been using BW since version 7 and there has been no consistent fixed release cycle. We do know there will be a BW10 at some time since Mike B. has already leaked some details of what he's working on for it, but there's no reason to think that there is an imminent release. A good time to release would be around SBL cycles because that gives them a great opportunity to reach a large customer base with great info about the next version. If there were a release imminent, you would hear about it because SBL is coming up in a matter of weeks.

Hi, I am new to these forums and am dreaming about owning BibleWorks. I know this has been talked about before, but I am wondering if there are any indications as to when BW10 will be released. I do not want to buy 9 and then see 10 come out the next week. Does BW announce new releases in advance? Any thoughts you have on this would be helpful. Thanks.

Michael Hanel
11-16-2013, 08:42 PM
Hi, I am new to these forums and am dreaming about owning BibleWorks. I know this has been talked about before, but I am wondering if there are any indications as to when BW10 will be released. I do not want to buy 9 and then see 10 come out the next week. Does BW announce new releases in advance? Any thoughts you have on this would be helpful. Thanks.

Officially, there is no immediate sign of a BW10 release. Generally, BW won't really announce a new release until after beta-testing because once a new release is announced people will stop buying and wait until the next version to come out instead. Since BW isn't a monster company, it is greatly hurt by those periods, which is why they minimize the time as much as they can.

Unofficially (I have no insider knowledge on this, this is just speculation), I would guess that BW10 will come out next year sometime, but my guess is later in the year rather than earlier (I'm still of the mind that 3rd quarter of the year is a good time to release because of SBL and such, but I'm just an armchair speculator). I have no real foundation for this claim, it's just my hunch. The owner has said he's working on BW10, but hasn't dropped any hints about a release, so I just think if you were in need of BW, it'd be foolish to wait because you could be waiting for quite a while.

Though I must say, I'd be more than happy to be wrong on this one. It's always exciting to see what a new version has to offer :-)

[This post (http://www.bibleworks.com/forums/showthread.php?5705-New-Version-Timetable&p=30070#post30070) has a little bit more of the context for my guess (based on release cycles)]

DavidR
11-17-2013, 11:11 AM
Hi, I am new to these forums and am dreaming about owning BibleWorks. I know this has been talked about before, but I am wondering if there are any indications as to when BW10 will be released. I do not want to buy 9 and then see 10 come out the next week. Does BW announce new releases in advance? Any thoughts you have on this would be helpful. Thanks.
As Michael H. indicated, a new release, while impossible to predict, is probably not imminent. In any case, my recollection is that the BW people are very righteous about upgrades for recent purchasers: they don't charge the full program price or even the full upgrade price to people who have bought the current version of the program within a certain recent time span.

DanDan
11-17-2013, 04:19 PM
Thank you for your comments Michael and David. All that I need to decide now is if BW fits into my current budget. I would love to buy it before the end of the year. Thanks again.

dmivapi
11-19-2013, 03:30 AM
1.Just the way the .bna files provide the way to type the reference in my own language (Russian) - without pressing INS each time - to change my current language to English,
would be great to be able to have maybe .bva files for each language - to provide aliases for Bible versions in my own language. I do not know how many times I have to press INS.

2. Switching between tabs, setting search limit, etc also requires to press INS to swich from my language to English. It would be great to have either text file - where I could set a pair in local language to these English commands ("b", "l", etc) - it would change the work speed dramatically!

3. Disregarding current keyboard language when pressing shortcuts in other BW windows (like when pressing "b" in browsing window.

If this will be implemented - put it in the list of changes - so that me and other users like me would know this - and thus would be encouraged to switch to a new version.

brainout
11-19-2013, 04:31 AM
If, my memory services me correctly it was on June 28th, 2011 that I ordered my copy of BibleWorks9. Meaning, that current version of BibleWorks is about a year a half old. That's not too old I guess? So by now most of BibleWorks' user base has had time to update to version 9 and play around with it. So, after using and getting to know BibleWorks9 I pose the following:



What would you like to see in version 10 of BibleWorks?
Is, there anything that you would like BibleWorks to retain?
Is, there anything that you would like BibleWorks to get rid of?
Is, there anything that you would like BibleWorks to add or change?



Maybe forgive me for sounding a little testy here, but I'm trying to convey that there are serious usage problems. People buy BibleWorks based on my (Youtube, 'brainouty') videos showing it, and then are shocked to discover how high is the learning curve. So my testy rhetoric below, is partly on their behalf.

1a. EASIER ACTIVATION. The current system is a royal pain. It's bad enough you have to type in each long module code, let alone go through activation per module code also; and of course not all of them allow internet activation, but you aren't told which ones; you're only given ALL internet or ALL manual, and the process for manual is unbelievably complex. Seems unfair to the BW staff to use individual emails for activation. If one has the download, or has the DVDs, can't that be enough 'proof', just to get the thing activated and up-and-running? Especially, since the individual module codes have to be typed in, as well?

1b. OPTIONS WINDOW WHICH CAN BE SIZED. This is a deal breaker, if not fixed. The buttons are masked. My Dell Latitude 6510 has FHD, but no matter what resolution I chose, because I couldn't SIZE the options window, couldn't select version order. That inability, renders the entire BW program useless, on that machine. Dual monitors don't help. This isn't a problem on non-FHD screens. OH WAIT! There is a fix for FHD so that the buttons aren't hidden: and it's the SCREEN that needs to change; but this 'fix' only works in BW9. (Yet BW8 still won't work with FHD; vertical scroll bar disappears, and because the Options Window cannot be resized, the buttons are hidden.) Here's how I got those buttons back in BW9. In Windows 7, Select Control Panel All Items, then look for the 'Performance Information and Tools' option. Then, first upper left option, 'Adjust visual effects'. Then, at the bottom of that listing, UNcheck 'use visual styles on windows and buttons'. This reverts to the classic Windows Blue and Gray from 3.11 days. But then, back to Personalize, select Windows Color, and you have the old XP style selections. Make them as you choose (much better, imo, because now you can size and color your fonts and backgrounds). After doing all that, then again Personalize, then Display (lower left corner of Personalize window), then select 'Medium' font (125%).

Now call up BW, scroll down to Version Order. The buttons are back, easily useful. Yay.

1c. BETTER DEFAULTS. Who can read Arial font, now? It's thin and unreadable, the bane of using Windows; default font should be darker, thicker, more like Cambria or some other easier screen-to-read (best one is Comic Sans, for reading onscreen). Who needs that 'Daily Light' prompt as the default? Why isn't the default 'off', allowing the user to turn it on? Why are there defaults ON for accent/vowel point searching, and other things that are rarely useful? And the 4.0 style search box is still faster to use when changing Bible books in a search, than the default offered now. Also, why should the default for updates be every 48 hours, checked? Stuff like that.

2. Other than listed in 1 above, please retain what's there. PLEASE DO NOT CHANGE THE INTERFACE. That's why Windows 8 is a flop, they changed the interface. We need to have the same basic structure that's familiar.

3. Get rid of the problems listed above in 1a-1c. Also, please allow the user to use different colors or different 'something' to distinguish the buttons now in BW9. They look too much alike, now. Also, allow the user to CHANGE THE HIGHLIGHT COLOR when marking out text with the mouse. The default slate blue obscures the text. It's a nasty feature of Adobe Reader, and a nastier feature of BW, because slate blue on black makes for unreadability. Adobe never learned that. BW, can. (Honestly, I don't understand this trend of light grey text on glare white or glare blue backgrounds in websites and MS Office products, or dark gray text on dark backgrounds, too-thin font faces yet huge glaring pictures that tell you nothing. World has gone mad.)

The above kinda serves under '4', too. Here are two other items needing fixes or improvement.

4a. Make setting up Favorites easier: back in BW5, you could clone a Favorite and build on it. The whole setup is hard to do over and over and over. Since redoing that is a programming hassle for you guys, then restore the ability to clone a previous Favorite, to make a new one, rather than just 'Display_01' appearing anew. Better still, can't the Favorites be spun out into their own configuration file, and then be ported in? If like me you owned several full copies of BW, it's a real pain to have to do all those Favorites over and over per machine (as the sole user of them).

4b. PLEASE GET BIG KITTEL? I'm stuck using Logos for it now, and their interface is totally annoying. If TDNT could be purchased and used under a BW lexicon interface, that would be fantastic. I don't care what it costs, either. Better than hardback, if it's in BW; so if the hardback is $500 (price in Amazon), then how much more valuable, if in BW software? So far as I know, Accordance and Logos have licenses. Why can't BW get one, too? But I don't know how hard it would be, to fit it inside the lexicon modules.

All this being said, I live on BibleWorks, and wouldn't trade it for any other software on the planet. Even so, the folks who buy it because of my videos have a lot of problems learning it, so they need these changes even more than I do.

I've been using it for over 10 years, so for me these are annoyances to grouse about and then shut up. So, shutting up now, thank you for your time!

brainout
11-19-2013, 04:46 AM
I strongly second this one! It can be useful to focus on a small unit of the text, but generally speaking "verse-by-verse" exegesis is (or should be) a thing of the past. We need the verses as a standard reference system, but for reading, understanding, and analyzing the text, we need to work with sentence and paragraph units. Many of the texts in BW do have paragraph divisions available, and you can show those markers (in Browse Window Configuration Options). But it would be great to have the Browse Window and Browse tab in the Analysis Window have an option to display paragraphs as such, without the verse breaks.
Why is that so important? Forgive me, I don't see the difference between what you're saying, and what I get when only one version is in Browse mode. Paragraph divisions are artificial, too. Just ignore all the verse markings, and go by syntax. Or am I missing something? Thank you for any time you spend in reply!

Lee
11-19-2013, 10:25 AM
4b. PLEASE GET BIG KITTEL? I'm stuck using Logos for it now, and their interface is totally annoying. If TDNT could be purchased and used under a BW lexicon interface, that would be fantastic. I don't care what it costs, either. Better than hardback, if it's in BW; so if the hardback is $500 (price in Amazon), then how much more valuable, if in BW software? So far as I know, Accordance and Logos have licenses. Why can't BW get one, too? But I don't know how hard it would be, to fit it inside the lexicon modules.

TDNT is $100 at CBD. I don't think there are very many users who would be willing to pay $500, or anything close to that, for a TDNT module.

brainout
11-19-2013, 12:53 PM
TDNT is $100 at CBD. I don't think there are very many users who would be willing to pay $500, or anything close to that, for a TDNT module.
What is 'CBD'? Thank you for your reply. I find Kittel very useful, well worth the price, but hardback is too hard to search. In Logos, you have to use not only their interface, but their keyboard, which is a hassle. Too many advertisements and syrupy stuff, too.

Mark Eddy
11-19-2013, 02:21 PM
What is 'CBD'?

Christian Book Distributors. They have a bi-monthly catalogue which they can send to you. You can also find them online. Before I started using BibleWorks, I used to buy hundreds of dollars of books from CBD every year. Now I hardly ever use those books, because most of what I need is on BW.
Mark Eddy

Mark Eddy
11-19-2013, 02:48 PM
1a. EASIER ACTIVATION. The current system is a royal pain. It's bad enough you have to type in each long module code, let alone go through activation per module code also; and of course not all of them allow internet activation, but you aren't told which ones; you're only given ALL internet or ALL manual, and the process for manual is unbelievably complex. Seems unfair to the BW staff to use individual emails for activation. If one has the download, or has the DVDs, can't that be enough 'proof', just to get the thing activated and up-and-running? Especially, since the individual module codes have to be typed in, as well?
BW9 already has easier activation than previous versions. You do not have to type in all your access codes. You just copy them from the e-mail which BW sends you when you buy them, and paste them all at once onto the activation window in BW, and once you click the right button to activate them, you're activated in seconds. Or, if you are upgrading, BW9 automatically searches to see if you owned modules previously, and those codes are imported into BW9 at activation. The only people who have had problems are those who uninstall and reinstall multiple times. That raises a red flag at BW, that perhaps someone is passing around a single copy of BW to multiple users. That's when the phone call clears things up.


1c. BETTER DEFAULTS. Who can read Arial font, now?
I can read Arial just fine, and I'm no spring chicken.

It's thin and unreadable, the bane of using Windows; default font should be darker, thicker, more like Cambria or some other easier screen-to-read (best one is Comic Sans, for reading onscreen). To each his own. BW allows you to change fonts, if you like.

Who needs that 'Daily Light' prompt as the default? Why isn't the default 'off', allowing the user to turn it on? The programmers find it salutary to look at a daily dose of God's word before they get down to programming. Maybe we all do.

Why are there defaults ON for accent/vowel point searching, and other things that are rarely useful? And the 4.0 style search box is still faster to use when changing Bible books in a search, than the default offered now. Also, why should the default for updates be every 48 hours, checked? What would you suggest as the alternative? When a new release of BW comes out, there are always small bugs, and the programmers fix them promptly, so checking for updates every other day makes sense. After a release has been out for a few months, you wouldn't have to check for updates that often.


3. Get rid of the problems listed above in 1a-1c. Also, please allow the user to use different colors or different 'something' to distinguish the buttons now in BW9. They look too much alike, now. Also, allow the user to CHANGE THE HIGHLIGHT COLOR when marking out text with the mouse. The default slate blue obscures the text. It's a nasty feature of Adobe Reader, and a nastier feature of BW, because slate blue on black makes for unreadability. Adobe never learned that. BW, can. (Honestly, I don't understand this trend of light grey text on glare white or glare blue backgrounds in websites and MS Office products, or dark gray text on dark backgrounds, too-thin font faces yet huge glaring pictures that tell you nothing. World has gone mad.)
My eye doctor call what you have presbyopia (older eyes). When we were younger we used to be able to distinguish small contrasts. The older our eyes get, the more contrast we need.


4a. Make setting up Favorites easier: back in BW5, you could clone a Favorite and build on it. The whole setup is hard to do over and over and over. Since redoing that is a programming hassle for you guys, then restore the ability to clone a previous Favorite, to make a new one, rather than just 'Display_01' appearing anew. Better still, can't the Favorites be spun out into their own configuration file, and then be ported in? If like me you owned several full copies of BW, it's a real pain to have to do all those Favorites over and over per machine (as the sole user of them).
Again, BW9 already fixed this. Once you have set up favorites, BW9 can copy them into its BW900.ini file. Also, when you are setting up favorites, when you start at new one (Display_01) it automatically starts with the contents of the favorite which was open previously. Isn't that the same as a "clone"? So, before you start a new Favorite, be sure to open an existing Favorite which is close to what you want the new one to contain.


the folks who buy it because of my videos have a lot of problems learning it, so they need these changes even more than I do.
That is why BW has so many videos to introduce how to do what it can do. And that is also why we have this forum, so get tips, if the videos didn't show you how to do what you want to do. But I suspect that if you suggest some functions to be included on future videos, you can probably get those included.
Mark Eddy

DavidR
11-19-2013, 05:57 PM
Again, BW9 already fixed this. Once you have set up favorites, BW9 can copy them into its BW900.ini file. Also, when you are setting up favorites, when you start at new one (Display_01) it automatically starts with the contents of the favorite which was open previously. Isn't that the same as a "clone"? So, before you start a new Favorite, be sure to open an existing Favorite which is close to what you want the new one to contain.
This is true; but for managing BW on multiple computers (e.g., my desktop and my laptop), it would be handy if there were an export/import favorites feature. As it is, I have to edit BW900.ini to copy favorites from one setup to the other one. Unless there's an easier way I just don't know about!

DavidR
11-19-2013, 06:11 PM
Why is that so important? Forgive me, I don't see the difference between what you're saying, and what I get when only one version is in Browse mode. Paragraph divisions are artificial, too. Just ignore all the verse markings, and go by syntax. Or am I missing something? Thank you for any time you spend in reply!
The subject here (for those who've lost their index to this absurdly long thread) is the display of the text in the Browse Window or Browse tab of the Analysis Window with each verse as a separate paragraph when in single-version mode. Brainout, I don't know how you're getting this mode without this verse-by-verse display. Heaven knows, I could have overlooked a setting.

It's difficult to just ignore the verse markings, since each verse is a separate paragraph. This becomes even more of a problem when copying and pasting multiple verses into word-processing software, for instance. Since the program clearly knows where the paragraph divisions are (since it is possible to use the Browse Window Configuration Options to show paragraph markers), I'd think it would be fairly easy to include a configuration option to just have paragraphs display as paragraphs, with verse numbers shown within them.

To be sure, paragraph divisions are also artificial. But they are also part of most modern translations, and reflect important translational decisions, which I think should be represented in digital displays of them.

jfidel
11-19-2013, 07:03 PM
To be sure, paragraph divisions are also artificial. But they are also part of most modern translations, and reflect important translational decisions, which I think should be represented in digital displays of them.

I agree with David. The request is not to put paragraphs in the Greek texts, but they are part of each translation. How a translations breaks up the English translation into paragraphs is important information and is part of each of those translations.

DavidR
11-20-2013, 11:44 AM
I agree with David. The request is not to put paragraphs in the Greek texts, but they are part of each translation. How a translations breaks up the English translation into paragraphs is important information and is part of each of those translations.
In fact, even the paragraphing in modern editions of the Greek NT (and LXX for that matter) reflects conscious editorial decisions. "Discourse segmentation" (as the UBS Greek editions have taken to calling it) is an important area of exegetical analysis. An option to shows these paragraphs, rather than the verse-by-verse paragraphing, would allow users to see these decisions and compare them between editions. While one might not always agree with the contemporary editors on this, it's worthwhile to have the text displayed as they have arranged it. OTOH, an option to show a continuously flowing Greek (or Hebrew) text, with no divisions at all between verses or paragraphs, would show the text more as ancient readers saw it.

haydnguy
11-20-2013, 02:24 PM
Officially, there is no immediate sign of a BW10 release. Generally, BW won't really announce a new release until after beta-testing because once a new release is announced people will stop buying and wait until the next version to come out instead. Since BW isn't a monster company, it is greatly hurt by those periods, which is why they minimize the time as much as they can.

Unofficially (I have no insider knowledge on this, this is just speculation), I would guess that BW10 will come out next year sometime, but my guess is later in the year rather than earlier (I'm still of the mind that 3rd quarter of the year is a good time to release because of SBL and such, but I'm just an armchair speculator). I have no real foundation for this claim, it's just my hunch. The owner has said he's working on BW10, but hasn't dropped any hints about a release, so I just think if you were in need of BW, it'd be foolish to wait because you could be waiting for quite a while.

Though I must say, I'd be more than happy to be wrong on this one. It's always exciting to see what a new version has to offer :-)

[This post (http://www.bibleworks.com/forums/showthread.php?5705-New-Version-Timetable&p=30070#post30070) has a little bit more of the context for my guess (based on release cycles)]


I have been a BW user since BW 6. I have felt that each version has been a definitely good improvement over the previous version. Based on the quote you linked to, I am wondering if BW10 will be less about new features of the program and more about making it run on Windows 8, tablets, etc. I am very happy with BW9 but am still going to use a desktop for the foreseeable future on Windows 7 so a new version that is geared toward more "platforms" would be of less interest to me. I would tell anyone that is not running Windows 8 already that BW9 is a very good edition that I'm sure they would not be disappointed with. :)

SkipB
11-20-2013, 05:18 PM
I think it unlikely that a version update would focus on expanding platforms as the most prominent feature. I am currently using BW9 on a Lenovo Thinkpad Tablet2 running Windows 8.1. On a homebrew desktop under Win 8 Pro 64 bit. And a Lenovo X220 laptop wifh Win 7. The program works very well in each of those environments already.

One only needs to look through this forum to see how commited the company is to making the current version run on a Mac.

As a long term user I would be very surprised if BW 10 does not contain more than a few major enhancements.

Jim Wert
11-20-2013, 11:14 PM
In fact, even the paragraphing in modern editions of the Greek NT (and LXX for that matter) reflects conscious editorial decisions. "Discourse segmentation" (as the UBS Greek editions have taken to calling it) is an important area of exegetical analysis. An option to shows these paragraphs, rather than the verse-by-verse paragraphing, would allow users to see these decisions and compare them between editions. While one might not always agree with the contemporary editors on this, it's worthwhile to have the text displayed as they have arranged it. OTOH, an option to show a continuously flowing Greek (or Hebrew) text, with no divisions at all between verses or paragraphs, would show the text more as ancient readers saw it.

If you don't want to see each verse as a paragraph, specify a range on the command line. The verse numbers still do show up (inconspicuously). You must be in "display multiple versions" mode -- if you use single version display mode it goes back to breaking at verse change.

1162

haydnguy
11-21-2013, 01:43 AM
I think it unlikely that a version update would focus on expanding platforms as the most prominent feature. I am currently using BW9 on a Lenovo Thinkpad Tablet2 running Windows 8.1. On a homebrew desktop under Win 8 Pro 64 bit. And a Lenovo X220 laptop wifh Win 7. The program works very well in each of those environments already.

One only needs to look through this forum to see how commited the company is to making the current version run on a Mac.

As a long term user I would be very surprised if BW 10 does not contain more than a few major enhancements.

Thank you for your response, SkipB. It is certainly good news that it is already running on Windows 8.x. I assume that you are using it in Desktop mode in Windows 8.x

SkipB
11-21-2013, 05:24 AM
BibleWorks 9 does run in desktop mode. Even Microsoft Word 2013 switches to desktop mode to run. I have added Classic Shell to my installations. This puts a Win 7 style start button and menu on the desktop. In my style of work all the programs that do the heavy lifting run on the desktop. But Windows 8.x has proven to be more stable than 7. I have gone 3 or 4 weeks without rebooting my desktop at times.

DavidR
11-21-2013, 01:14 PM
If you don't want to see each verse as a paragraph, specify a range on the command line. The verse numbers still do show up (inconspicuously). You must be in "display multiple versions" mode -- if you use single version display mode it goes back to breaking at verse change.

Ah yes, of course. Sorry! :o

haydnguy
11-21-2013, 04:03 PM
@SkipB:

I actually spent a good deal of time during the "beta phase" trying to get Windows 8 to work on my computer before I really knew much about it and finally got stopped by Secure Boot. When they came out with an "Upgrade Advisor" I ran it and it said that my machine wasn't compatible because of that. I have not seen much discussion about that in the reviews, etc., but I can't help but believe that this is what has stopped some people from upgrading. I'm sure that the next computer I get will have Windows 8 on it though so I'm glad you posted your experience. :cool:

sjkuehn
12-05-2013, 10:27 AM
I have an ASUS Droid table. It would be nice if BW10 would work on a Droid

Joshua Luna
12-23-2013, 03:15 PM
In Bibleworks 10 I want to see interface changes that are focus on Accessibility with the intent to improve Visibility of features/content and end-user Flexibility in these regards. Something that is forward looking toward the various devices and places Bibleworks is uses and flexible enough to allow users to make changes without needing to wait for another product release.

My first version of Bibleworks was 3.5 and on every wish list thread I believe I requested layout/GUI changes. This time is no different. In fact I believe this time the MOST important change needs to happen in the Interface, not the features/content/tools. Bibleworks is so insanely deep and so exceedingly fast that adding a new translation here, a new reference there, a tool tweak there, doesn’t register very high on my wish list. Don’t get me wrong, there are great things that can be added to Bibleworks but if there was one area I believe needed improvement and that could quickly and easily prompt an upgrade it would be the interface.

This has always been one of my nitpicks. Going from my multi-display desktop to a smaller screen laptop always accented in my mind how Bibleworks was really designed with “old school” users at a desk on large, higher resolution screens in mind. It was usable on a laptop but best on a desktop (imo). Now that I am using Bibleworks on a wide screen laptop (i.e. not a tall screen) and high resolution but small (10 inch) tablet, primarily in landscape view (very tall, but narrow, screen!), these issues are glaring. The advances in user interfaces in the industry over the last decade has been staggering, and mostly beneficial for usability (especially new users), and I hope Bibleworks spends a lot of time looking into these areas. I will throw out some ideas below.

Ribbon-like Menu Interface. A ribbon interface may not be ideal, and Bibleworks may have a better idea for the interface, but I believe this should be considered. I know Microsoft’s ribbon is a love/hate feature for long time Office users (and I imagine long time Biblework’s users may have similar angst) but I believe there is something to be learned from this feature. Microsoft went with a ribbon for a number of reasons but most agree that as Office capabilities grew the Menu bar and sub-menus expanded, become more complex, and many features were obscured or hidden away. This required new users to spend substantial time digging to find basic features and it even resulted in seasoned users not knowing about great features buried deep within the menu hierarchy. The ribbon, for new users, allows quicker access and more exposure to the application.

Bibleworks has very similar design pressures: Bibleworks is robust, both in terms of tools, features, and content. This makes Bibleworks a great program. It also makes the program intimidating to many new users (based on reviews and discussion threads on other software forums) and often great features, tools, and content are overlooked due to the complexity of the program. Now that physical manuals are a thing of the past I personally believe that user interface and software guided workflow solutions are more important than ever. The software industry trend has been exceedingly focused on user interfaces and many times a good, clean, effective and efficient user interface that does all the core tasks better than the competition wins out over having more features with a less refined user interface.

Btw, the new tab that expands approach is a good way to save screen space and make the ribbon options only visible when needed.

Alt. example: “Context Rose.” This is more of an example than a recommendation (although it could work well if designed right). Way back in the day many programs used the Function Keys (F1-F12) as shortcuts. This was popular in strategy games and sims. But this has been phased out in games with a “Context Rose” which is a fancy way of saying when a key (e.g. ‘Q’) or button (e.g. Mouse Right) a context sensitive “ring” or “rose” appears with specific tasks that can be performed and the user then moves the mouse to the “petal” of the rose and selects the desired task. E.g.

Hover over the command line (search) would prompt a rose with: Change version, change range, search parameters (and, or, both, phrase, etc), copy results, open Hebrew/Greek keyboard, etc.

Hover over a highlighted word(s) in a verse would prompt a rose with: Search word(s), search lemma, related verse tool, TSK (X-refs), lexicon, browse passage context, etc.

This idea would actually work very well on the desktop (mouse) but also touch (finger) interfaces.

New layout interface—CSS / web-CMS inspired. Aside from the menu system I think the next big design issue is the ability to lay out the screen as desired. Bibleworks 9 made a big splash with the “4th column” but that, imo, was a stop gap for larger interface changes. The computing industry is moving very, very quickly and Bibleworks (imo) needs to have a flexible enough interface to meet the variety of devices and purposes the program is used for. On the processor side Intel just released Bay Trail and next year will see Airmont; basically low end x86/64 desktop class processors are in tablets now and will be in mobile phones soon. These devices are not only powerful but affordable (I just bought an HP Omni 10, more than ample hardware for Bibleworks, for $350). Mobile devices are often used in Portrait mode, instead of landscape, which is a big issue for Bibleworks—especially with 4 columns. Another issue is the resolution of these devices ranges from sub-HD (below 720p) to above Full HD (1080p+) and come in a variety of aspect ratios (16:9, 16:10, 4:3). Laptops and desktops almost all have very high resolution displays with wide aspects and many users have multiple displays.

For these reasons I don’t believe there is “a single solution” to meet all these design pressures.

My suggestion would be for an exceedingly flexible layout engine—think blocks or panels—that users could tweak to their heart’s content. This approach has been longstanding in the “web” world and has gained a lot of traction as the layout engine can adapt to different devices. The idea I have in mind is not unlike the Drupal CMS (or the like). The concept is simple: You have a basic frame, broken into fields, and each design unit of content is a “box” or “block”. The user can divide the “frame” by selecting the number and size of the horizontal top and bottom sections (header and footer) and then also select the number and width of columns (1,2,3,4,etc). So you have a frame divided up into a number of “fields”. The next part is “populating” the frame. Drupal has each unit of content, features, or tools defined as a “box”. These “box” can be (1) placed into any field and (2) Multiple “blocks” can be stacked in any field.

The end result is a flexible and fluid design platform that can be catered to meet a WIDE variety of user needs & abilities and would make Bibleworks exceedingly usable on an equally wide array of devices.

Bibleworks themselves would provide a number of “stock” layouts for new users. E.g. Bibleworks could offer 4 stock layouts. Two “Slim” layouts (one each for portrait and landscape) and two “Robust” (again, one each for portrait and landscape). The “Slim” layouts would be ideal for novice users and for lower resolution and/or small screens. The “Robust” layouts would be for power users and more robust sized displays. In “my” ideal world Bibleworks would do both a Ribbon-interface and user definable Block-layout – and the Ribbon-Interface would have 2 formats (Horizontal and Verticle).

These suggestions are not to say I don’t like Bibleworks—I believe the concept of the Left-to-Right workflow and use of tabs for frequently utilized sub-menus allows a LOT of power in a tight workflow. But my own personal opinion is the user interface could be simplified/streamlined significantly to make it friendly for new users and quicker at core tasks while customizable enough to be of even greater use to power users. Little things can make a huge difference (e.g. using a specific icon, like an “I” with a circle around it like (i) where all options and advanced features for a block are nested would go a LONG way to cleaning up the interface).

Another way Bibleworks could improve is presentation of current content or tools to quickly extract/summarize data and present it in a nice visual layout (e.g. Accordance breaks down stem usage nicely; Logos breaks down how a Hebrew word is translated into Greek nicely; etc). Some nice “report” features where such tasks can be auto-processed and output would be nice—and in a perfect world these sort of report/batch/output tasks could be user defined, stored, and recalled (e.g. saved as a user task).

I look forward to seeing what you guys come up with for Bibleworks 10—I am certain it will be great!

Examples of proposed layout schema below.

1168
1169
1170

DavidR
12-23-2013, 03:58 PM
When I first looked at this post (in a thread that I thought a long time ago had passed its useful life-span), I kind of thought, "Ack, what now?" But as I read through it, I found a lot of food for thought. Thanks, Joshua. I certainly have no idea what the BW developers are thinking, but you do propose some creative ideas to take advantage of the variety of screens and platforms now available. I too find that I need a different layout on my laptop from my desktop, and if I had a tablet that would be yet a different story. Personally, I'm a layout-tinkerin' fool, and I'd love the chance to play around with this sort of thing. Anyway, thanks again for an interesting and thought-provoking post.

And a Merry Christmas to all here!

brainout
12-24-2013, 01:18 PM
When I first looked at this post (in a thread that I thought a long time ago had passed its useful life-span), I kind of thought, "Ack, what now?" But as I read through it, I found a lot of food for thought. Thanks, Joshua. I certainly have no idea what the BW developers are thinking, but you do propose some creative ideas to take advantage of the variety of screens and platforms now available. I too find that I need a different layout on my laptop from my desktop, and if I had a tablet that would be yet a different story. Personally, I'm a layout-tinkerin' fool, and I'd love the chance to play around with this sort of thing. Anyway, thanks again for an interesting and thought-provoking post.

And a Merry Christmas to all here!

What I miss the most in BW5, is the ability to use multi-version for the X-refs. I've done a lot of Youtube (and vimeo) videos using BibleWorks live on screen, and it's so nice to just click on the TSK database, with the mss and the various translations in my same selected favorites (as in Browse window proper). It's easy to show, for example, how the NT quotes the LXX verbatim so often (needed, as the KJVONLY folks insist that the Greek OT was manufactured by Origen, which would make every NT Bible translation including KJV, a hoax). But in BW8 and 9 (I have both), I can't do that. So I don't use the newer versions in my videos. Folks who've bought BibleWorks because of my videos, have asked me why my videos look so different, and each time I have to explain that making videos with the later versions, is harder. This is fundamentally why.

(FYI, I made a playlist on how to use BW8; and included in that playlist are the BW channel's own videos, too. But of course the interface is much richer, now.)

So: if we're really gonna go whole-hog with our wish lists, here's another idea. Back during BW4 days, you could SEPARATE THE COMPONENTS instead of being stuck with one window and all the components. Frankly, I hate ribbons, so don't want that idea Joshua posed, adopted. I hate the MS Office ribbon so much, I won't upgrade. Maybe it's okay for some, but it's a primary feature in Logos software, and the primary reason I'll never buy anything Logos. (I was stuck buying TDNT in Logos over a year ago because back then, no one else had it. But thankfully Accordance and others do now, see my TDNT video description in vimeo.com.)

So how to satisfy such different needs? MAKE BIBLEWORKS MODULAR AGAIN. Just allow the window components to be separated like BW4 did. The program already saves the last configuration you did (Option Flags allows that), so then everyone can be happy.

Oh: and PLEASE and THANK YOU for preserving the 4.0 style Search Limits dialogue box, still allowing us the Option Flag to preserve it. The new default search box is as unwieldy as it gets.

MERRY CHRISTMAS!!

PS: after initially posting this, it dawned on me what a privilege it is to actually be able to TALK BIBLE and not worry about the other person's reaction. So here's a new slogan you'll recognize:

'BibleWorks software? About $350.
Being able to use and TALK about it? Priceless!'

pasquale
12-30-2013, 07:39 AM
In BibleWorks 10 I would like to have:
1) The translation of the graphical interface of the program, so that a user can select a different language from English. (I am available to the translation of the graphical user interface in Italian language).
2) To be able to create a database/dictionary, personal dictionary as a new supported database, connected to the Greek Bibles as “The Lexicon and Dictionary Browser”. To be able to look up any word or entry in the Bible text. To be able to do wildcard searches on both the list of entries and on the entire text of the databases. To be able to search the body text for Greek and Hebrew words. To be able to copy selected text to the clipboard to insert in a word processor.

grazie
Pasquale

thanasisglt
12-31-2013, 11:43 AM
Hi, i would like to see the program, dictionaries, lexicons, maps, everything in Bibleworks 10 in Greek. :o

brainout
12-31-2013, 11:54 PM
I'm just now installing and trying to use BW9. Astonishingly, the BW5 feature of being able to navigate from context to context is absent. When I search on 'context' in the Help contents, the word doesn't even exist???

In BW5, it was so handy to go to a verse, then just hit the back button for 'prior context' and be immediately back where one was. Or, to hit the forward button later, and go back to 'next context'. In BW9, there is nothing like that feature. It renders BW9 well nigh unusable for multiple verse comparison.

Now, if this feature was given another name, what is it? And if it was removed, PLEASE PUT IT BACK!

It's also distressing, how one cannot view the X-refs in but one version at a time. In BW5, if you had the Browse window in multiple-version mode, the X-refs would also show in that mode. Worse, the colors are bad. BW defaults to a white color when the selection is on a particular section (this sad fact is true for all the tabs), so I have to change my Windows 'selection' setting to a dark color, lest I not be able to read the BW tab entries selected, at all. In BW5, this was not the case.

So, I'll go back to BW5, and sparingly use BW9. Hopefully these things will be fixed in BW10.

Mark Eddy
01-01-2014, 12:05 AM
If I understand brainout correctly, you can still go back to the previous verse. Above the command line, to the upper right of the 12 tabs for favorites are two buttons, a left-pointing arrow and a right-pointing arrow. If you click on the left-pointing arrow, your browse window goes to the previous verse you had been looking at, and you can keep going back to previous searches by continuing to click on the button. Then you may click on the right-pointing arrow to go back to the verse you left. My guess is that this is not called the "context" arrow, since most exegetes who hear the word "context" would think of verses surrounding the current verse, not previous verses we had searched. Does this help?
Mark Eddy

brainout
01-01-2014, 12:19 AM
If I understand brainout correctly, you can still go back to the previous verse. Above the command line, to the upper right of the 12 tabs for favorites are two buttons, a left-pointing arrow and a right-pointing arrow. If you click on the left-pointing arrow, your browse window goes to the previous verse you had been looking at, and you can keep going back to previous searches by continuing to click on the button. Then you may click on the right-pointing arrow to go back to the verse you left. My guess is that this is not called the "context" arrow, since most exegetes who hear the word "context" would think of verses surrounding the current verse, not previous verses we had searched. Does this help?
Mark Eddy
That function is not really the same. In BW5, you got a drop-down menu where you SAW a full list of the contexts used in the session, and could select among them. Granted, the back and forward buttons above the command line in BW9 are better than nothing, but they are only linear, and don't give you a list to choose from. So if you have a great memory for exactly what path you took, fine. If not, then not so fine. Especially, if you're looking at a LOT of verses.

I'll go now and look at my BW8, to see if it suffered the same fate. I never used BW8 much, so maybe the context is there. Look: I own three full copies, plus version 4 (version 5 was an upgrade, I think). So I'm not trying to knock BW. I don't even want to live, without BW. Seriously. But were I a scholar or even a pastor (wrong gender, lol), I'd really want to be able to quickly cycle through many verses being compared, while analyzing the text. It's an important feature.

Mark Eddy
01-01-2014, 05:17 PM
That function is not really the same. In BW5, you got a drop-down menu where you SAW a full list of the contexts used in the session, and could select among them. Granted, the back and forward buttons above the command line in BW9 are better than nothing, but they are only linear, and don't give you a list to choose from. So if you have a great memory for exactly what path you took, fine. If not, then not so fine. Especially, if you're looking at a LOT of verses.

Have you tried using the "Verse History" or "Word History" lists? There are icons for each of these. If you open these, you can see the last 100 verses you searched and the last 100 words you searched. If you just scroll between verses, these are not recorded, but searched verses are.
Mark Eddy

brainout
01-01-2014, 05:43 PM
Have you tried using the "Verse History" or "Word History" lists? There are icons for each of these. If you open these, you can see the last 100 verses you searched and the last 100 words you searched. If you just scroll between verses, these are not recorded, but searched verses are.
Mark Eddy
Yes, I sometimes use them. But as you just said, they don't track your looking up verses, but only your searches. You already have those wonderful tabs at left, for the searches. But as you go through the verses in each tab, the verse history and word history list don't track all that. Thank you!

brainout
01-05-2014, 02:04 PM
The subject here (for those who've lost their index to this absurdly long thread) is the display of the text in the Browse Window or Browse tab of the Analysis Window with each verse as a separate paragraph when in single-version mode. Brainout, I don't know how you're getting this mode without this verse-by-verse display. Heaven knows, I could have overlooked a setting.

It's difficult to just ignore the verse markings, since each verse is a separate paragraph. This becomes even more of a problem when copying and pasting multiple verses into word-processing software, for instance. Since the program clearly knows where the paragraph divisions are (since it is possible to use the Browse Window Configuration Options to show paragraph markers), I'd think it would be fairly easy to include a configuration option to just have paragraphs display as paragraphs, with verse numbers shown within them.

To be sure, paragraph divisions are also artificial. But they are also part of most modern translations, and reflect important translational decisions, which I think should be represented in digital displays of them.
You can turn off the verse and version markers in Options Flags. Or, you can size them to be small. So I don't notice them when in Browse Window, though frankly I've no need for the paragraph feature, as I don't use translations except for searching. Sorry I can't be more helpful!

brainout
01-05-2014, 02:10 PM
My replies are in Green, interspersed in the text.

BW9 already has easier activation than previous versions. You do not have to type in all your access codes. You just copy them from the e-mail which BW sends you when you buy them, and paste them all at once onto the activation window in BW, and once you click the right button to activate them, you're activated in seconds. Or, if you are upgrading, BW9 automatically searches to see if you owned modules previously, and those codes are imported into BW9 at activation. The only people who have had problems are those who uninstall and reinstall multiple times. That raises a red flag at BW, that perhaps someone is passing around a single copy of BW to multiple users. That's when the phone call clears things up. Actually, this isn't true. My BW9 copy with the codes was NOT in email, but paper. I couldn't paste anything. The codes have to be input, because they have those little boxes. Worse, the previous registrations for BW8 and 5, no longer can be done by computer, but have to be done manually. The BW9 registration wiped out the prior, so now it's a bigger hassle than ever.

I can read Arial just fine, and I'm no spring chicken. Great for you, but not so great for those who aren't sitting with their noses to the screens. I can read any text when my face is a foot from the screen, too.
To each his own. BW allows you to change fonts, if you like. I know that, but my complaint was about the related stuff which cannot be changed.
The programmers find it salutary to look at a daily dose of God's word before they get down to programming. Maybe we all do. One can get a daily dose by picking any passage, instead of it being forced.
What would you suggest as the alternative? When a new release of BW comes out, there are always small bugs, and the programmers fix them promptly, so checking for updates every other day makes sense. After a release has been out for a few months, you wouldn't have to check for updates that often. I don't see why you bring this up, as my post was on what I'd like to see in BW10.

My eye doctor call what you have presbyopia (older eyes). When we were younger we used to be able to distinguish small contrasts. The older our eyes get, the more contrast we need. And the relevance of this is...?

Again, BW9 already fixed this. Once you have set up favorites, BW9 can copy them into its BW900.ini file. Also, when you are setting up favorites, when you start at new one (Display_01) it automatically starts with the contents of the favorite which was open previously. Isn't that the same as a "clone"? So, before you start a new Favorite, be sure to open an existing Favorite which is close to what you want the new one to contain. I know that too, but when deploying BW on multiple machines of which I'm the only user, it doesn't work.

That is why BW has so many videos to introduce how to do what it can do. And that is also why we have this forum, so get tips, if the videos didn't show you how to do what you want to do. But I suspect that if you suggest some functions to be included on future videos, you can probably get those included.
Mark Eddy I'll just bypass your comment on the videos. I've been using BW since version 4.

More relevant are these three problems which hopefully BW10 will address:

1. Windows has its own colors for selected text; in BW5, these colors were passed on to BW, but in versions 8 and 9, the unreadable SLATE BLUE of the old Adobe programs, is the default highlight text which you can't undo. Granted, now there's the complicated COLORIZE function, but it's not as quick and easy as just allowing the user's own Select Text colors for Windows, pass through to BW.

2. This problem is compounded, by another default in the X-refs tab, which forces selected text to be WHITE. Here, the Windows Select Text default for the HIGHLIGHT is passed onto BW, but not the TEXT COLOR in Windows. So, if you use light highlight but dark text in Windows, you cannot read the selected verse in X-refs, as it forces the text to be white.

Click here for attached screenshot (http://www.brainout.net/BW9HighlightProb.jpg) , showing the highlight problem. It matters a lot, if you're trying to show something to a colleague and you are recording the screen live.

3. The X-refs no longer operate like they did in BW5, where your Auto-info window would show in multi-version mode if your Browse Window was also in that mode. This was a handy feature, for you could easily click on a Cross-reference verse, and the versions would all show (i.e., you could see the Hebrew/Greek text, if you set up your Browse Window Favorites that way). So in BW8-9 you have many more steps to go through, to see a particular verse in X-refs, display fully for comparison.

The #3 might be hard to restore in BW10, but #1 and #2 should be easy. That, and restoring the BW4 ability to take apart the modules instead of forcing them all to occupy one window, would be the most helpful changes in the interface. I say all this because people buy BibleWorks based on my videos, and I end up using BW5 for the video recordings, instead of 8 and 9, which are frankly too hard to use. The last person who bought BW based on my videos complained about the difficulty, and wants me to do videos showing how to do the same things, in BW9. But what can I say? What I can do in BW5 onscreen, can't be done in later versions. Ergo my wishlist, above.

brainout
01-05-2014, 02:47 PM
In BibleWorks 10 I would like to have:
1) The translation of the graphical interface of the program, so that a user can select a different language from English. (I am available to the translation of the graphical user interface in Italian language).
2) To be able to create a database/dictionary, personal dictionary as a new supported database, connected to the Greek Bibles as “The Lexicon and Dictionary Browser”. To be able to look up any word or entry in the Bible text. To be able to do wildcard searches on both the list of entries and on the entire text of the databases. To be able to search the body text for Greek and Hebrew words. To be able to copy selected text to the clipboard to insert in a word processor.

grazie
Pasquale
The items I marked in Green, you can already do. Creating your own database and linking it within BW is a bit complicated, but there is help on it within BW. The Help on SEARCH will answer how you do searching, and yes you can use wildcards. Although the program's own instructions won't be in Italian, you can do these searches and dictionaries IN the Italian versions. That's one way I remember Italian, by loading up the Italian versions and then searching on some ENGLISH Bible, then displaying the Italian versions. :) Best way to learn another language (and people have done it this way for centuries), is by learning Bible in a given language: for, you already know the verses in your own language version.

Mark Hangartner
01-15-2014, 07:10 PM
I would suggest:



a search interface that is easier to navigate - the current option of a single line with 3 clickable buttons and various options none of which are that obvious is confusing to the average user.


having a "global reset" button would be helpful (we have a networked version in a library) .... this means if students get really stuck they can close a session and open a new one with everything reset to some defaults I have chosen. But the closing and startup can be time consuming. If the student could just reset to defaults that would help.


having an ezyproxy verified internet version

cmyktaylor
04-22-2014, 11:48 AM
First, we're getting close to two [oops, I mean THREE (http://www.bibleworks.com/forums/showthread.php?4933-BibleWorks-New-Version-Offers-Unequalled-Capabilities)] years since BibleWorks 9 was released, so I'm hoping that it's too late for my input! That said, I would love to see BW include arcing or bracketing (see www.biblearc.com (http://www.biblearc.com)). Second, now that there is a better Mac platform, I'd like to see an iPad version (doesn't need full functionality!), which could be used remotely when away from the internet or my Mac.

Donald Cobb
04-26-2014, 04:36 AM
I don't know where things are at on this, but, at the risk of hearing David Rensberger sigh loudly... :)

This is something I've been meaning to suggest for some time. I would love to see the reverse search of the Lexicons tweaked some. As it is now, if you want to look for the Greek equivalents of an English word in, say, the Middle Liddel or the BDAG, you have to do it one word at a time (for those who might not be aware of this feature, you can access it by clicking on "Lexicons" => "Edit" => "search").

It would be very helpful to have all a summary of all the entries appear at the same time. There are Internet sites and other programs that do this, but it would be appreciable for BW10 to add this feature!

I wanted to paste in a couple of images. For some reason, I can't seem to do it. But here is a link that gives an example of this:

http://perseus.uchicago.edu/perseus-cgi/search3torth?dbname=LSJ&ORTHMODE=unaccented&dgdivhead=&matchtype=sameold&word=wealth&CONJUNCT=PHRASE

What are thoughts on this?

Donald Cobb
Aix-en-Provence, France

P.S.: Sorry for the "a" in the title. It was supposed to be: "No end to suggestions..."

DavidR
04-26-2014, 04:47 PM
Oh, I gave up sighing over this a long time ago, Donald! I'm just glad I'm not one of the ones who have to work through this thread looking for suggestions that might be adopted.

In fact, this is a good idea. I've done my share of LSJ searching for English definitions, which can sometimes be vexing if the English word you're looking for commonly shows up in definitions unrelated to its own main meaning. I'll have to remember to use Perseus for this purpose!

jmorgan
06-19-2014, 05:26 AM
If, my memory services me correctly it was on June 28th, 2011 that I ordered my copy of BibleWorks9. Meaning, that current version of BibleWorks is about a year a half old. That's not too old I guess? So by now most of BibleWorks' user base has had time to update to version 9 and play around with it. So, after using and getting to know BibleWorks9 I pose the following:



What would you like to see in version 10 of BibleWorks?
Is, there anything that you would like BibleWorks to retain?
Is, there anything that you would like BibleWorks to get rid of?
Is, there anything that you would like BibleWorks to add or change?



I've been using BibleWorks 9 for a little more than a year now, so here are my suggestions thus far.

1. Create an option to hide the search window. When I am studying a single passage in depth and am not using the search window very much it would be nice to make full use of my screen real-estate.

2. Single click to update Analysis Window. Holding shift is a little awkward just to move over to scroll through a lexicon entry, apparatus, or manuscript as well as when only updating when shift is pressed, as I still have to move the cursor to get it to update. If there was extended options on this functionality so that one could set it to their preferred method of use beyond using the shift key that would be nice. The most comfortable setting would be to have a single click for Analysis window updates, and a double click for searching.

3. Keep the manuscripts coming. This is definitely my favorite feature of BibleWorks 9, and I would love to see more of it. Papyrus Fragments, and Dead Sea Scrolls would be welcomed additions.

4. More OT study tools. The BHS critical apparatus for one would be quite welcome.

5. Unicode integration. Most Bible scholars are used to typing in Greek and Hebrew using whatever keyboard layout they prefer. It would be nice to be able to search etc. by using your own keyboard layout commands.

6. Custom tabs. Several of the tabs I never use such as Words, Context, or Stats. It would be nice to be able to declutter.

7. More Browse/Analysis windows available on the main screen. This would be similar to the Parallel versions pop-up, but on the main screen and allowing for other features to be integrated as well. Possible set ups could be; two browse windows with different manuscripts in type and manuscript images underneath, multiple translations side by side with the CNTTS apparatus etc. You get the idea.

You could set up BibleWorks such that you start with one window and can add or remove windows. You could have the option of whether the new window is a search, browse, analysis, manuscript window etc. You could designate which windows are linked together through some sort of option setting on each. Along this line it would also be nice to be able to have the pop-up items such as grammars, or maps in-line so that you can see everything at once.

8. Flash Card memory. It would be nice to be able to save your place in the flash card module for what you have already learned.


Overall I have thoroughly appreciated BibleWorks. Out of the different Bible Softwares that I own, I use BibleWorks more by far. Keep up the good work.

jmorgan
06-19-2014, 05:43 AM
Ok, one more....

I should be able to set my search version to something different than is in my Browse window. I have no desire to ever try to read through a morphologically tagged edition in my Browse window, though I do want to be able to search by morphology. It gets kind of tedious to constantly have to switch my browse window back to a readable text.

Mark Eddy
06-19-2014, 08:24 PM
Ok, one more....

I should be able to set my search version to something different than is in my Browse window. I have no desire to ever try to read through a morphologically tagged edition in my Browse window, though I do want to be able to search by morphology. It gets kind of tedious to constantly have to switch my browse window back to a readable text.
You can already do this. In the "Options" window, under "Brows Window Configuration Options," check "Maintain search version after lemma search." So, if you set your search version to BGT or BNT or WTT (or any other text version with a corresponding morphology version), when you do a lemma search, the BGM or BNM or WTM (etc.) will not display in your browse window (unless you go back to the list of searches, and click on one of them. In that case the morphology version will display). This way you do not have to close down the morphology version each time you search. I have my version of BW set up this way constantly.
Mark Eddy

Mark Eddy
06-19-2014, 08:58 PM
2. Single click to update Analysis Window. Holding shift is a little awkward just to move over to scroll through a lexicon entry, apparatus, or manuscript as well as when only updating when shift is pressed, as I still have to move the cursor to get it to update. If there was extended options on this functionality so that one could set it to their preferred method of use beyond using the shift key that would be nice. The most comfortable setting would be to have a single click for Analysis window updates, and a double click for searching.
I think you can already sort of do what you want. After you put your cursor over a word, right click with the mouse, and move your cursor to the Analysis window to scroll through it. (Ignore the window which displays by right clicking. It will disappear once you start scrolling through the Analysis window.)


7. More Browse/Analysis windows available on the main screen. This would be similar to the Parallel versions pop-up, but on the main screen and allowing for other features to be integrated as well. Possible set ups could be; two browse windows with different manuscripts in type and manuscript images underneath, multiple translations side by side with the CNTTS apparatus etc. You get the idea.
You can sort of do this by cloning BW and using different versions in the browse windows of the clone.


8. Flash Card memory. It would be nice to be able to save your place in the flash card module for what you have already learned.

You can already mark words in the flash cards as learned, and they will be grayed out the next time you go through the flash cards. I haven't done this in a while, but when I learned words, I seldom learned them equally well. The words I knew, I eliminated from the list by marking them as learned. So I go through the unlearned words first the next time I used the flash cards. Once I had gone through them, I got to new words.
Mark Eddy

Donald Cobb
06-20-2014, 02:16 AM
2. Single click to update Analysis Window. Holding shift is a little awkward just to move over to scroll through a lexicon entry, apparatus, or manuscript as well as when only updating when shift is pressed, as I still have to move the cursor to get it to update. If there was extended options on this functionality so that one could set it to their preferred method of use beyond using the shift key that would be nice. The most comfortable setting would be to have a single click for Analysis window updates, and a double click for searching.

If you use the resources panel, you can also just click on the word as it shows up there. This opens up the Lexicon entry in a floating window.

I use the resources panel almost continuously now, I find it to be a great time saver, and if the specific Scripture reference is indicated in the lexicon--as is the case for BDAG, which lists practically all occurrences of any given word in the NT, including any varia lectio--it opens the entry to the precise spot that mentions the passage. This is very helpful, especially when the entry is long. Obviously, all that goes for HALOT as well in the OT, although the referenced passages seem to be a little less complete.

Donald Cobb
Aix-en-Provence, France

Donald Cobb
06-20-2014, 02:28 AM
I've been using BibleWorks 9 for a little more than a year now, so here are my suggestions thus far.

1. Create an option to hide the search window. When I am studying a single passage in depth and am not using the search window very much it would be nice to make full use of my screen real-estate.

[…]

3. Keep the manuscripts coming. This is definitely my favorite feature of BibleWorks 9, and I would love to see more of it. Papyrus Fragments, and Dead Sea Scrolls would be welcomed additions.

4. More OT study tools. The BHS critical apparatus for one would be quite welcome.

5. Unicode integration. Most Bible scholars are used to typing in Greek and Hebrew using whatever keyboard layout they prefer. It would be nice to be able to search etc. by using your own keyboard layout commands.

6. Custom tabs. Several of the tabs I never use such as Words, Context, or Stats. It would be nice to be able to declutter.

7. More Browse/Analysis windows available on the main screen. This would be similar to the Parallel versions pop-up, but on the main screen and allowing for other features to be integrated as well. Possible set ups could be; two browse windows with different manuscripts in type and manuscript images underneath, multiple translations side by side with the CNTTS apparatus etc. You get the idea.

You could set up BibleWorks such that you start with one window and can add or remove windows. You could have the option of whether the new window is a search, browse, analysis, manuscript window etc. You could designate which windows are linked together through some sort of option setting on each. Along this line it would also be nice to be able to have the pop-up items such as grammars, or maps in-line so that you can see everything at once.



Concerning 1., I second that. I've often found that, when you are not using the search window, it does take up space that could be better used for other things. Sometimes, I open a floating analysis window that I configure to cover up the space taken by the search window. Your points 3., 4., 5. and 6. have already been suggested on this post, so they confirm an expressed need (or at least desire).

If I understand your 7., that would be more like a Logos or Accordance setup? I think that has also been suggested. It would be a fairly radically different approach to what BW has always looked like, but I can certainly see the advantages. In my mind, that would have to be coupled with the possibility of saving different specific setups, something I've already suggested!

Donald Cobb
Aix-en-Provence, France

bink
06-20-2014, 04:03 PM
[QUOTE=Mark Eddy;29382]I have started morphological databases for a number of the classical or koine Greek databases which Michael Hanel has made available: Aristophanes, Epictetus, Herodotus, Plato, and Xenophon.

Mike, I've been lazy and haven't added these (or transferred) to a new laptop I use since April. Any easy way to do all or same way as 2-3 years ago? Also, any difference that I'm using Windows 7 Professional?

jwb

bink
06-20-2014, 04:13 PM
I've awakened from skipping a generation (BW9, and several years of hard BW IT work you guys are doing) :) All these suggestions for a BW10 are great, bring them on, it's time the gub-ment is paid again for the work I don't do! jwb

Lee
06-20-2014, 06:23 PM
You can already do this. In the "Options" window, under "Brows Window Configuration Options," check "Maintain search version after lemma search." So, if you set your search version to BGT or BNT or WTT (or any other text version with a corresponding morphology version), when you do a lemma search, the BGM or BNM or WTM (etc.) will not display in your browse window (unless you go back to the list of searches, and click on one of them. In that case the morphology version will display). This way you do not have to close down the morphology version each time you search. I have my version of BW set up this way constantly.
Mark Eddy

Thanks for the info; I wasn't aware of that.

However, what jmorgan says would still apply when doing Command Line searches with a morphology version. Even though I do those often, I pretty much never care to see the morphology text displayed in the Browse Window. So let me choose WTM (for example) as my search version, but still see WTT as the Browse Window text.

Donald Cobb
06-21-2014, 02:39 AM
Thanks for the info; I wasn't aware of that.

However, what jmorgan says would still apply when doing Command Line searches with a morphology version. Even though I do those often, I pretty much never care to see the morphology text displayed in the Browse Window. So let me choose WTM (for example) as my search version, but still see WTT as the Browse Window text.

Hello Lee. I think what you are looking for is already possible in BW9. In the Browse window configuration options, click "maintain search version after lemma search". Then try removing WTM from your browse window and doing a right-click "search on lemma". You should then get the lemma results without the WTM version becoming visible.

FWIW, I personally appreciate having the lemma version on (but far down the list, where I can't see it), because if you then want to copy a word into a word processor, you get it exactly as you would find it in the lexicon. Copying from the analysis window, at least for Greek, gives you the word in bold type, which you then have to "un-bold".

Regards,

Don Cobb

Lee
06-22-2014, 09:52 PM
Hello Lee. I think what you are looking for is already possible in BW9. In the Browse window configuration options, click "maintain search version after lemma search". Then try removing WTM from your browse window and doing a right-click "search on lemma". You should then get the lemma results without the WTM version becoming visible.

Right, Don. But I was referring specifically to Command Line searches, not right-click "Search on Lemma" searches.

Mark Eddy
08-02-2014, 04:20 PM
How hard would it be for BW 10 (should God so will that it come) to remember a different synopsis tool to accompany the different tabs? Right now BW remembers the last synopsis tool which was opened by the user (regardless of tab). But when I am in my Old Testament tab and open the synopsis tool, I don't want the Aland synopsis of the Gospels. I want something which compares OT with NT or OT to OT. But then, if I switch to my NT tab, I may want that Aland synopsis. But, alas! if I had the OT synopsis open last, that opens instead of Aland. And it cannot open to the NT passage I am studying. So I have to open the desired synopsis, which only opens to the beginning, not to the passage open in my tab. It is great that the synopsis tool tries to open the synopsis window to the passage the user is studying in the analysis window. But if the last synopsis tool you used was in the other testament, BW (obviously) cannot find an appropriate synopsis spot to open, so you have to scroll through to see if one exists. Have I made myself clear?
Mark Eddy

Michael Tarver
08-11-2014, 07:30 PM
So I like to set up BWs with 2 windows. But whenever I minimize the program it automatically defaults to 3 windows, adding the Search Window, when I bring BWs program back up.

Below are pics showing what I talking about:

I'll set it up like so...
1223

Then it returns to this after I minimize BW and bring it back up...
1224


It's annoying. I hope BW tries to fix this. Thanks for listening.

bink
09-08-2014, 02:32 PM
Would love to see BW10 keeping up with the Jones's, stay competitive in the sense of resources, let publishers and author's know many of us are not buying it in printed text but will use it as BW10 Users/Consumer/Client. My hope is that we are not, soon, obsolete, and the force(s) push us elsewhere.

Ideas would be starting with more lexical resources/tools added such as the forthcoming New International Dictionary of New Testament Theology, 2 ed, (5 vol), NIDOTT for that matter at some point. Negotiate for adding OT Grammar and Syntax, Exegesis Handbooks for both OT and NT, etc, etc.

jwb

bink
09-08-2014, 03:03 PM
I stopped too short, just to push it a little further on the wish list... a few choices of resources on the spectrum regarding NT/OT TC, Idioms, Verbal Aspect, NT Discourse Grammar, and work on Prepositions. Why not dream when it's out there. jwb

Peter
09-19-2014, 04:19 PM
I stopped too short, just to push it a little further on the wish list... a few choices of resources on the spectrum regarding NT/OT TC, Idioms, Verbal Aspect, NT Discourse Grammar, and work on Prepositions. Why not dream when it's out there. jwb

Hi, everything ok, but not the Verbal Aspect of Porter or Campell, what no Classicist would approve. Just new fancy ideas but nothing to do with sound linguistics. Sorry to say that, I've read these books and they would disturb or cause damage for a normal reading of the Word of God. Rest ok. I love Runge.
P.

Dale A. Brueggemann
10-25-2014, 12:45 PM
I would love to see BW include arcing or bracketing (see www.biblearc.com (http://www.biblearc.com)).... an iPad version (doesn't need full functionality!).

Here's my vote for both of these. On the "arcing," otherwise known as propositional analysis, I would rather see a robust application of this than the watered down version on www.biblearc.com.