PDA

View Full Version : Copy/Paste Unicode BW7 to MS OneNote



Cris
03-14-2009, 11:32 AM
I've seen several discussions of problems pasting from BW7 to various applications. Here's my try:

Has anyone been able to directly copy/paste Unicode Greek or Hebrew from BW7 to OneNote?

It works if I copy from BW to OpenOffice Writer and then from OOW to OneNote. I suspect the problem may have to do with what BW puts on the clipboard. Although OOW recognizes the text as Unicode, neither OneNote, the Windows Clipbook Viewer (Clipbrd.exe), or ClipX (http://clipx.org/) (a third-party clipboard manager) see the Unicode text correctly.
I've attached two screenshots showing what the Windows viewer sees when copied from BW7 (first) and from OpenOffice (second).

Any ideas?

(I have Export Fonts activated, Gk: Palatono Linotype/Unicode, Hebrew: SBL Hebrew/Unicode)

FredGreco
03-14-2009, 01:58 PM
I have a related issue. I can't paste Unicode from BW8 into a text box. When I do, I get this:


??? ?????????? ???????

If I copy to MS Word first, I get this:


καὶ ἀπέστρεψεν Εζεκιας


I supposed it was a limitation of the program (browser). Could it be the same with OneNote?

Cris
03-14-2009, 02:34 PM
Fred,

I went to the Wikipedia page for Hebrews (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hebrews), copied אברהם and pasted here, OneNote and in GMail correctly. Doing so from BW7 produces: ~h'Ír"b.a;

There are multiple formats associated with data in the clipboard (as you can see in the screenshots). When Unicode is listed as the first format, everything works. BW is giving Unicode last, and text format (e.g., BWHeb mapping) first. I suspect that most applications will take the first usable format. So if 'text' appears before Unicode, text is what the app uses. OpenOffice appears to be a bit more selective.

spartachris
09-16-2009, 11:33 AM
So is there a way to fix this in Bibleworks?

Cris
09-16-2009, 11:55 AM
So is there a way to fix this in Bibleworks?

There's a way for BibleWorks to fix it, but not for a mere user.

The problem is that what BW7 exports as UnicodeText is not Unicode, it's BWGreek or BWHeb ASCII characters marked as Unicode. This would lead me to assume that they have no clue about how Unicode works (there are different code ranges for different languages/alphabets), but they actually seem to have correct Unicode characters in their RTF export.

Word processing apps (Word, OOWriter) seem to prefer RTF, so I paste from BW to Writer and then copy from Writer (which does the UnicodeText correctly) and paste to OneNote.

I don't know if BibleWorks doesn't understand this issue, or just doesn't care about it. It's not a missing feature, it's a bug in a claimed feature.

spartachris
09-16-2009, 02:15 PM
Thanks for the info, Cris.

I'm going to assume that Bibleworks knows about this bug? It's kind of frustrating to have to paste twice...

Thanks again!

MBushell
09-16-2009, 02:55 PM
So is there a way to fix this in Bibleworks?

There's a way for BibleWorks to fix it, but not for a mere user.

The problem is that what BW7 exports as UnicodeText is not Unicode, it's BWGreek or BWHeb ASCII characters marked as Unicode. This would lead me to assume that they have no clue about how Unicode works (there are different code ranges for different languages/alphabets), but they actually seem to have correct Unicode characters in their RTF export.

Word processing apps (Word, OOWriter) seem to prefer RTF, so I paste from BW to Writer and then copy from Writer (which does the UnicodeText correctly) and paste to OneNote.

I don't know if BibleWorks doesn't understand this issue, or just doesn't care about it. It's not a missing feature, it's a bug in a claimed feature.
I frankly don't understand the tone of this comment. We do in fact "have a clue about how Unicode works" (do you?). And we do care about making BibleWorks useful. So why the snide comments? How is that helpful to anyone?

Michael Hanel
09-16-2009, 03:00 PM
So is there a way to fix this in Bibleworks?

There's a way for BibleWorks to fix it, but not for a mere user.

The problem is that what BW7 exports as UnicodeText is not Unicode, it's BWGreek or BWHeb ASCII characters marked as Unicode. This would lead me to assume that they have no clue about how Unicode works (there are different code ranges for different languages/alphabets), but they actually seem to have correct Unicode characters in their RTF export.

Word processing apps (Word, OOWriter) seem to prefer RTF, so I paste from BW to Writer and then copy from Writer (which does the UnicodeText correctly) and paste to OneNote.

I don't know if BibleWorks doesn't understand this issue, or just doesn't care about it. It's not a missing feature, it's a bug in a claimed feature.

Cris, I'm not a programmer, I don't know exactly the nature of the bug you're facing and I do realize that it is frustrating, but you're likely not going to get a happy resolution based on the nature of your post.

It's pretty clear there is a problem with the Unicode. I don't know whose fault that is, but you clearly seem to think you know and the reason you give is because of the unintelligence of the programmers.

Now, no matter what the problem is, if you're the programmer and you read that kind of a comment, do you really think it's going to get positive resolution? It's fine to post bugs, complaints, whatever here, it's just more likely to be listened to when it's done in a more tactful way.

And I'm sorry if I am reading you wrong, it just kind of rubbed me the wrong way.

Here's what I do know. Based on my experience, sometimes Unicode is exported fine from BibleWorks and sometimes it's not (usually it's fine in Microsoft programs, not fine in some of the other ones (notably Firefox)). The reason I've been told that this happens is not something BibleWorks can handle but has to do with how these other programs receive Unicode from Windows, in which case it's up to these other programs to use the same standards Microsoft does. Now whether this is actually the case or not, I certainly couldn't prove since I'm no programmer, but I believe that's what has been reported before.

spartachris
09-16-2009, 03:20 PM
(Writing in a concilliatory, interceding way:)

Ok...I'm sorry if my question was upsetting to Cris or anyone else. I feel responsible for raising the issue and asking it.

But to clarify things.... should I make a bug report or something about this?

Is there something I can do to fix the problem with MS OneNote? Is it a problem with OneNote, or is there a way I can tinker with BW to get it to perform correctly with OneNote?

I should say I know nothing about Unicode, but I've been using BW since ver. 3 (upgraded from ver.5 to 8 this week).

Thanks for the help!

Michael Hanel
09-16-2009, 03:31 PM
(Writing in a concilliatory, interceding way:)

Ok...I'm sorry if my question was upsetting to Cris or anyone else. I feel responsible for raising the issue and asking it.

But to clarify things.... should I make a bug report or something about this?

Is there something I can do to fix the problem with MS OneNote? Is it a problem with OneNote, or is there a way I can tinker with BW to get it to perform correctly with OneNote?

I should say I know nothing about Unicode, but I've been using BW since ver. 3 (upgraded from ver.5 to 8 this week).

Thanks for the help!

I would say you can try working with BibleWorks support about the issue. I can certainly verify that Unicode itself is not broken. It pastes fine into Word, but it doesn't into OneNote. I can't tell you whether that can be fixed or not, but at least the support people can perhaps tell you more about the nature of the problem than anyone here can.

spartachris
09-16-2009, 03:55 PM
Thanks Michael! I submitted a request for support. I'm also going to try to use the bw fonts to see if that will work.

And BTW, double thanks for your blog and Lutheran resources!

Christopher Hall
Redeemer Lutheran Church, Enid OK
3rd Vice President, Oklahoma District LCMS

Michael Hanel
09-16-2009, 03:59 PM
Thanks Michael! I submitted a request for support. I'm also going to try to use the bw fonts to see if that will work.

And BTW, double thanks for your blog and Lutheran resources!

Christopher Hall
Redeemer Lutheran Church, Enid OK
3rd Vice President, Oklahoma District LCMS

BW fonts should not be a problem. The issue has to do with how Unicode is converted between the software programs. Beyond that I don't understand anything :)

Thanks, I only wish I had more time to do more. I have the files for a further revision of the Book of Concord module, but haven't had the time to add them.

spartachris
09-16-2009, 04:27 PM
My solution didn't work :(

I followed the FAQ on turning off Unicode, and it worked when I copied/pasted text into Word 2007, showing the bw font.

When I pasted the same text into OneNote, it showed ???? because it's changing all the text to the default OneNote font.

On the other hand, when I paste it in Word and bw font is there, and copy/paste that into OneNote, it keeps does not change the font. It accepts the data from Word correctly, but not directly from BW.

So I think Cris may be onto something with the "instructions" that BW is sending and how OneNote interprets them.

MBushell
09-16-2009, 05:43 PM
(Writing in a concilliatory, interceding way
Ok...I'm sorry if my question was upsetting to Cris or anyone else. I feel responsible for raising the issue and asking it.

But to clarify things.... should I make a bug report or something about this?

Is there something I can do to fix the problem with MS OneNote? Is it a problem with OneNote, or is there a way I can tinker with BW to get it to perform correctly with OneNote?

I should say I know nothing about Unicode, but I've been using BW since ver. 3 (upgraded from ver.5 to 8 this week).
Thanks for the help!
You didn't say anything to apologize for. Questions are always welcome if they are offered politely.

I looked into the OneNote issue. Apparently OneNote just ignores RTF text placed on the clipboard. That is very strange for a Microsoft Application. BibleWorks relied very heavily on RTF to export formatted text (including Unicode) and OneNote just doesn't support it. Currently BibleWorks places RTF and non-Unicode text on the clipboard. The program assumes that if someone is interested in Unicode text they will export to an application that supports RTF. Zero cheers for OneNote.

I can beef up the text export side of things so that it will work partially with OneNote. What it will do is just place the Unicode text on the clipboard and tag it as Unicode in a single default font (determined by OneNote). None of the formatting will carry over but there is nothing we can do about that until OneNote supports RTF or we export HTML. We will think about the possibility of exporting HTML. That seems to be what OneNote wants, but that will require a major effort. Stay tuned. We'll do what we can.

God bless,
Mike

By the way. The comments made by Cris are wrong. We place RTF and (non-Unicode) text on the clipboard. All the other formats identified in his Clipboard reader are generated by Windows automatically. They weren't put there by BibleWorks. Windows does that for maximum functionality but it does have some unwanted side effects at times. The only real way to fix your OneNote problem is for us to export HTML.

spartachris
09-16-2009, 07:51 PM
Mike--thank you very much, and I really appreciate your work on this!

The changes since v5 are incredible, and while the notes function seems to work much more intuitively in v8, having all my exegetical notes together with the lectionary readings and all the other things OneNote collects is pretty handy....although ERMIE seems to be a similarly minded collation system. I'm still trying to figure out my system, but anything you can do to help for now I really appreciate.

Thanks again!
Chris

MBushell
09-16-2009, 09:30 PM
Mike--thank you very much, and I really appreciate your work on this!

The changes since v5 are incredible, and while the notes function seems to work much more intuitively in v8, having all my exegetical notes together with the lectionary readings and all the other things OneNote collects is pretty handy....although ERMIE seems to be a similarly minded collation system. I'm still trying to figure out my system, but anything you can do to help for now I really appreciate.

Thanks again!
Chris
The problem is pretty clearly the fact that OneNote wants HTML input. I am looking into licensing an HTML - RTF converter. That would save a lot work but finding an option that is affordable and also handles Unicode Hebrew is a bit difficult. We'll do what we can.
Mike

Jim Wert
09-16-2009, 10:04 PM
I frankly don't understand the tone of this comment. We do in fact "have a clue about how Unicode works" (do you?). And we do care about making BibleWorks useful. So why the snide comments? How is that helpful to anyone?

Mr Bushell, I realize that BibleWorks is your best-loved child, that any criticism of it hurts. When I read this response, and remembered other similar ones, I was prompted to use Bibleworks to look up Proverbs 15:1. The NET notes for the verse spoke to me too.

Shalom,
Jim

Adelphos
09-16-2009, 10:11 PM
The problem is pretty clearly the fact that OneNote wants HTML input. I am looking into licensing an HTML - RTF converter. That would save a lot work but finding an option that is affordable and also handles Unicode Hebrew is a bit difficult. We'll do what we can.

You probably know this better than me, but in my conversations with other MS developers it seems pretty clear that MS is going all out to make HTML the workhorse in all its apps, as it's more universal than strict Unicode. Not that they will abandon Unicode, but for compatibility I think the concentration is going to be heavily on HTML.

I don't know how much coding it would involve on your end, but since HTML seems to be a given, you might want to consider biting the bullet and working it out. It may save you a lot of headaches down the road.

FWIW.

bkMitchell
09-16-2009, 11:36 PM
Mr Bushell, I realize that BibleWorks is your best-loved child, that any criticism of it hurts.

Jim, wait a minute...

One, this wasn't simply a criticism of the Bibleworks software, but it was verbal attack on the programmers!(notice):

"...This would lead me to assume that they have no clue about how Unicode works..."

"I don't know if BibleWorks doesn't understand this issue, or just doesn't care about it. It's not a missing feature, it's a bug in a claimed feature."


Two, don't you think it was curtious on the part of Mr. Bushell to personally reply to Cris and start a dialogue as well as to the many others on these forums he has replied to. He did not have to do that, did he?


Three, Mr. Bushell and Cris seemed to have come to an understanding already. So, why stir the pot, now?

Grace and Peace,
bkMitchell

MBushell
09-16-2009, 11:41 PM
You probably know this better than me, but in my conversations with other MS developers it seems pretty clear that MS is going all out to make HTML the workhorse in all its apps, as it's more universal than strict Unicode. Not that they will abandon Unicode, but for compatibility I think the concentration is going to be heavily on HTML.

I don't know how much coding it would involve on your end, but since HTML seems to be a given, you might want to consider biting the bullet and working it out. It may save you a lot of headaches down the road.

FWIW.

Scott,

HTML is a markup language with formatting instructions. Unicode is basically a large character set and has nothing to do with formatting. In fact HTML generally these days uses Unicode characters for text. So Miscrosoft isn't giving up on Unicode for HTML. It's apples and oranges. The question is whether Microsoft is going to continue to develop and support RTF as a markup language in addition to HTML. We are heavily invested in RTF and a switch at this point is not practical unless Microsoft forces it. But we do at some point have to support HTML as an output format - if OneNote is a clue to where Billy Gates is headed.

But we won't be adding ribbons to BibleWorks any time soon!

Mike

MBushell
09-16-2009, 11:46 PM
Mr Bushell, I realize that BibleWorks is your best-loved child, that any criticism of it hurts. When I read this response, and remembered other similar ones, I was prompted to use Bibleworks to look up Proverbs 15:1. The NET notes for the verse spoke to me too.

Shalom,
Jim

Jim,

I am not sure whether you intended your comment to apply to the original message or to my response, but I guess it applies to both. Thanks for the reminder.

Mike

ISalzman
09-17-2009, 10:34 AM
Mr Bushell, I realize that BibleWorks is your best-loved child, that any criticism of it hurts. When I read this response, and remembered other similar ones, I was prompted to use Bibleworks to look up Proverbs 15:1. The NET notes for the verse spoke to me too.

Shalom,
Jim

While not wishing to comment on this thread in any way, I will say, "Great verse, Jim!" Wow, what wisdom from our bible. "A soft (i.e., mollifying) answer turns away wrath." Simple but profound.

I'm currently reading Walter Kaiser's book Preaching and Teaching from the OT. In it he laments the church's reluctance to preach and teach from the OT, while, at the same time, noting that it constitutes more than three fourths of our Bible. Yet the common notion that most in the Church have bought into is that the OT doesn't speak to our situation as Christians. "Malarkey," is what I say. (And so would Kaiser!) The practical wisdom of Proverbs is more needed than ever today! Thanks for reminding me (us?) of that Jim!

Adelphos
09-17-2009, 10:44 AM
Scott,

HTML is a markup language with formatting instructions. Unicode is basically a large character set and has nothing to do with formatting. In fact HTML generally these days uses Unicode characters for text. So Miscrosoft isn't giving up on Unicode for HTML. It's apples and oranges. The question is whether Microsoft is going to continue to develop and support RTF as a markup language in addition to HTML. We are heavily invested in RTF and a switch at this point is not practical unless Microsoft forces it. But we do at some point have to support HTML as an output format - if OneNote is a clue to where Billy Gates is headed.

I don't know much about Unicode/HTML, but I do know that much. -:)

But what I'm told is that HTML is the preferred choice for MS on the compatibility plane. Of course, that will never address the issues with WP, but Unicode is still such a mishmash of confusion that HTML is now, and for the foreseeable future, will be the go-to guy in applications like OneNote and such like.

On the other hand, I was also told by a MS guy just the other day, and I'm sure you already know this as well, (but it was news to me), that ANSI strings in VS are converted to Unicode before calling the Win32 API, and then converted back again after the call. IOW, ANSI is now just a wrapper, which in larger apps might mean a performance hit.

So you may have to look forward to the day when you convert your entire project over to Unicode. Now then, swallow that one! ;)

MBushell
09-17-2009, 02:53 PM
SpartaChris,

Just to let you know, we have an RTF to HTML converter working now that should solve your problem and provide HTML output for almost all BW operations. We need to finish the coding and test a bit but the fix should be posted by the weekend.

God bless,
Mike

spartachris
09-17-2009, 02:58 PM
Mike--Wow! That was fast. Thank you so much for your work!

Christopher Hall

Adelphos
09-17-2009, 05:41 PM
SpartaChris,

Just to let you know, we have an RTF to HTML converter working now that should solve your problem and provide HTML output for almost all BW operations. We need to finish the coding and test a bit but the fix should be posted by the weekend.

That's just downright unfair... the fact that you could code this, and code it this fast, is just downright unfair to us fledgling programmers!

bkMitchell
09-17-2009, 08:19 PM
SpartaChris,

Just to let you know, we have an RTF to HTML converter working now that should solve your problem and provide HTML output for almost all BW operations. We need to finish the coding and test a bit but the fix should be posted by the weekend.

God bless,
Mike

Wow! That's amazing! Yet, another reason to stick with Bibleworks.
I can't think for any other software company where the lead programmer would respond so quickly(or even at all) in word and deed.

May God continue to bless the Bibleworks company and staff!

MBushell
09-17-2009, 10:44 PM
That's just downright unfair... the fact that you could code this, and code it this fast, is just downright unfair to us fledgling programmers!
Hi Scott,

To be honest I have to admit that we located a third party control that does decent RTF to HTML conversion, including Unicode Hebrew. It's just a matter of getting the license and doing the bookkeeping to plug it it where it needs to be plugged in. The hard part will be in finding the bugs that the change generates. We are also using it to add HTML save and load in the editor, but it won't be very feature rich as the conversion will have to be done every time a file is saved or loaded. But it should work for most things. We'll see.

Mike

Adelphos
09-18-2009, 06:42 AM
To be honest I have to admit that we located a third party control that does decent RTF to HTML conversion, including Unicode Hebrew. It's just a matter of getting the license and doing the bookkeeping to plug it it where it needs to be plugged in. The hard part will be in finding the bugs that the change generates. We are also using it to add HTML save and load in the editor, but it won't be very feature rich as the conversion will have to be done every time a file is saved or loaded. But it should work for most things. We'll see.

That's what you get for being hasty. I would have sold you mine a lot cheaper. Plus, mine not only converts Hebrew and Greek, but Southern as well.

MBushell
09-19-2009, 08:25 PM
Hi All,

I just uploaded the first cut at HTML support in BibleWorks 8. Here is what is in it:

1. When you copy most things to the clipboard, an HTML version will be put there as well. This enables formatted cut and paste to Microsoft OneNote and other applications that do not support RTF.

2. The editor can save and load HTML files. The base internal format is RTF so text is converted back and forth on load and save. This means that only basic HTML support is provided.

3. Formatted Drag and drop to OneNote works from the browse window but not from the editor because the Microsoft RichEdit control doesnít support it. I havenít yet figured out a way around this. But Cut and paste does work because I can intercept that.

4. Three DLLS are needed and should be installed with the exe.

5. These features are only available now in a beta executable. To access it use the access code BWHTMLBETA in the updater.

6. Converted images will be put in the same directory as the original.

7. Back up your note files if you have any important stuff there. This should not affect the note system but you never know. Remember that this is not a release version.

8. Both file saving and clipboard support for HTML are off by default. You can turn them on in the Setup Export Options section. It is off by default because recent versions of Word will choose HTML in preference to RTF for clipboard operations. It HTML is there it will use it. And since RTF works better we don't want to mess up the majority of people who are happy with RTF. If you use both Word and oneNote a lot I am sorry for the hassle.
I am not terribly pleased with the Hebrew results. Microsoft support for mixed Hebrew and English is very good now in RTF files. But that is not the case in HTML. After many hours of messing with this we are unable to construct mixed RTL and LTR HTML files that behave the same in Word, Internet Explorer and OneNote. It is clearly not a high priority with Microsoft. So you are going to see some problems with Hebrew. We'll do what we can to resolve them but no promises. We will work with the vendor who supplied the converter next week, but with Microsoft inconsistencies from app to app I am not sure what can be done.

Mike

ISalzman
09-19-2009, 08:49 PM
Hi All,

I just uploaded the first cut at HTML support in BibleWorks 8. Here is what is in it:

1. When you copy most things to the clipboard, an HTML version will be put there as well. This enables formatted cut and paste to Microsoft OneNote and other applications that do not support RTF.

2. The editor can save and load HTML files. The base internal format is RTF so text is converted back and forth on load and save. This means that only basic HTML support is provided.

3. Formatted Drag and drop to OneNote works from the browse window but not from the editor because the Microsoft RichEdit control doesnít support it. I havenít yet figured out a way around this. But Cut and paste does work because I can intercept that.

4. Three DLLS are needed and should be installed with the exe.

5. These features are only available now in a beta executable. To access it use the access code BWHTMLBETA in the updater.

6. Converted images will be put in the same directory as the original.

7. Back up your note files if you have any important stuff there. This should not affect the note system but you never know. Remember that this is not a release version.

8. Both file saving and clipboard support for HTML are off by default. You can turn them on in the Setup Export Options section. It is off by default because recent versions of Word will choose HTML in preference to RTF for clipboard operations. It HTML is there it will use it. And since RTF works better we don't want to mess up the majority of people who are happy with RTF. If you use both Word and oneNote a lot I am sorry for the hassle.
I am not terribly pleased with the Hebrew results. Microsoft support for mixed Hebrew and English is very good now in RTF files. But that is not the case in HTML. After many hours of messing with this we are unable to construct mixed RTL and LTR HTML files that behave the same in Word, Internet Explorer and OneNote. It is clearly not a high priority with Microsoft. So you are going to see some problems with Hebrew. We'll do what we can to resolve them but no promises. We will work with the vendor who supplied the converter next week, but with Microsoft inconsistencies from app to app I am not sure what can be done.

Mike

Hi Mike. I don't use MS One Note, so I don't think I want to fool or tinker with this now, especially since this is a beta version. Will this "patch" show up as one of the recommended updates in the BW updater? Again, I'd rather not accept this at the present time. I don't do MS One Note. And I do export a lot of Hebrew.

Michael Hanel
09-19-2009, 08:52 PM
Hi Mike. I don't use MS One Note, so I don't think I want to fool or tinker with this now, especially since this is a beta version. Will this "patch" show up as one of the recommended updates in the BW updater? Again, I'd rather not accept this at the present time. I don't do MS One Note. And I do export a lot of Hebrew.

It will not show up by default, you have to type in the access code (under Options) he listed when you open the updater.

ISalzman
09-19-2009, 08:58 PM
It will not show up by default, you have to type in the access code (under Options) he listed when you open the updater.

Thanks Michael. Totally unrelated to this, do you ever go for ice cream at Graders? I hear Cincinnati is famous for it. I've never had the ice cream myself, but my wife has. And, if memory serves me correctly, there's also some local chili that Cincinnatians boast about.

Michael Hanel
09-19-2009, 09:06 PM
Thanks Michael. Totally unrelated to this, do you ever go for ice cream at Graders? I hear Cincinnati is famous for it. I've never had the ice cream myself, but my wife has. And, if memory serves me correctly, there's also some local chili that Cincinnatians boast about.

Yes the ice cream is to die for, the chili is the means by which one might die. In other words, thumbs up for the ice cream, but the chili is not for me.

ISalzman
09-19-2009, 09:11 PM
Yes the ice cream is to die for, the chili is the means by which one might die. In other words, thumbs up for the ice cream, but the chili is not for me.

I gotcha. I'll have to try the ice cream one day, though it must be at least ten or eleven years since I've driven through Cincinnati. What's the name of the chili again?

MBushell
09-19-2009, 09:21 PM
I gotcha. I'll have to try the ice cream one day, though it must be at least ten or eleven years since I've driven through Cincinnati. What's the name of the chili again?

Sorry guys but you gotta go to San Antonio or Austin for decent chili.

Mike

Adelphos
09-19-2009, 09:39 PM
Sorry guys but you gotta go to San Antonio or Austin for decent chili.

San An and T-sip land makes some decent chili, but they ain't NOTHIN compared to College Station. Gig 'em Aggs!

ISalzman
09-19-2009, 09:39 PM
Sorry guys but you gotta go to San Antonio or Austin for decent chili.

Mike

So the chili at Wendy's doesn't cut it, huh?

Michael Hanel
09-19-2009, 09:40 PM
I gotcha. I'll have to try the ice cream one day, though it must be at least ten or eleven years since I've driven through Cincinnati. What's the name of the chili again?

The two competing businesses are Skyline and Gold Star Chili. I've only had Skyline, like I said, that was enough for me. I've heard some prefer one over the other, but give me real home-made chili any day over stuff that's been sitting in a vat for who knows how long. (There's also the "sweetness" that some don't like about Cincinnati chili, but that really wasn't the problem with me.)

ISalzman
09-19-2009, 09:43 PM
The two competing businesses are Skyline and Gold Star Chili. I've only had Skyline, like I said, that was enough for me. I've heard some prefer one over the other, but give me real home-made chili any day over stuff that's been sitting in a vat for who knows how long. (There's also the "sweetness" that some don't like about Cincinnati chili, but that really wasn't the problem with me.)

Skyline is the one that I had heard about, and that people that I know rave about.

By the way, do the Cincinnati Reds still play in Riverfront Stadium?

Michael Hanel
09-19-2009, 10:21 PM
Skyline is the one that I had heard about, and that people that I know rave about.

By the way, do the Cincinnati Reds still play in Riverfront Stadium?

No sir, "Great American Ballpark," which is an awesome name for a ballpark, a lucky insurance company with the same name (minus the ballpark part that is).

ISalzman
09-20-2009, 11:08 AM
No sir, "Great American Ballpark," which is an awesome name for a ballpark, a lucky insurance company with the same name (minus the ballpark part that is).

Wow. I used to love Riverfront Stadium with its picturesque setting on the river with a view of Covington KY in the foreground. It was about as beautiful a baseball stadium as you were ever going to see. I'm shocked to hear the Reds no longer play there (although I really shouldn't be; sports teams are moving to new stadia fairly commonly these days!). So did they just tear down Riverfront Stadium? Is the new and nicely named stadium built on or near the same location?

Michael Hanel
09-20-2009, 03:31 PM
Wow. I used to love Riverfront Stadium with its picturesque setting on the river with a view of Covington KY in the foreground. It was about as beautiful a baseball stadium as you were ever going to see. I'm shocked to hear the Reds no longer play there (although I really shouldn't be; sports teams are moving to new stadia fairly commonly these days!). So did they just tear down Riverfront Stadium? Is the new and nicely named stadium built on or near the same location?

I don't know anything about the old stadium, I've only been here for a couple years. I googled it and it says it was imploded in 2002. If you know the area you would know more, you can check google maps to see what the riverfront looks like today.

Michael Hanel
09-20-2009, 04:53 PM
Hi All,

I just uploaded the first cut at HTML support in BibleWorks 8. Here is what is in it:

1. When you copy most things to the clipboard, an HTML version will be put there as well. This enables formatted cut and paste to Microsoft OneNote and other applications that do not support RTF.

2. The editor can save and load HTML files. The base internal format is RTF so text is converted back and forth on load and save. This means that only basic HTML support is provided.

3. Formatted Drag and drop to OneNote works from the browse window but not from the editor because the Microsoft RichEdit control doesnít support it. I havenít yet figured out a way around this. But Cut and paste does work because I can intercept that.

4. Three DLLS are needed and should be installed with the exe.

5. These features are only available now in a beta executable. To access it use the access code BWHTMLBETA in the updater.

6. Converted images will be put in the same directory as the original.

7. Back up your note files if you have any important stuff there. This should not affect the note system but you never know. Remember that this is not a release version.

8. Both file saving and clipboard support for HTML are off by default. You can turn them on in the Setup Export Options section. It is off by default because recent versions of Word will choose HTML in preference to RTF for clipboard operations. It HTML is there it will use it. And since RTF works better we don't want to mess up the majority of people who are happy with RTF. If you use both Word and oneNote a lot I am sorry for the hassle.
I am not terribly pleased with the Hebrew results. Microsoft support for mixed Hebrew and English is very good now in RTF files. But that is not the case in HTML. After many hours of messing with this we are unable to construct mixed RTL and LTR HTML files that behave the same in Word, Internet Explorer and OneNote. It is clearly not a high priority with Microsoft. So you are going to see some problems with Hebrew. We'll do what we can to resolve them but no promises. We will work with the vendor who supplied the converter next week, but with Microsoft inconsistencies from app to app I am not sure what can be done.

Mike

Ok Mike, I'm running this beta EXE and I did not check the HTML exporting option. However, it is still copying CORRECTLY into OneNote. Did I miss something? Shouldn't it still not work, but if I check the HTML export option, then it WILL work? (I mean I'm not complaining, it works, I just thought it wouldn't work until I checked the box.)

So far this looks really slick as far as copying and pasting goes. Thanks for the work.

ISalzman
09-20-2009, 05:51 PM
I don't know anything about the old stadium, I've only been here for a couple years. I googled it and it says it was imploded in 2002. If you know the area you would know more, you can check google maps to see what the riverfront looks like today.

Thanks. I don't really know the area per se, though I drove through it on occasion when I used to go on speaking tours in Kentucky. But there was a time in my life that I used to watch a lot of baseball. I used to watch the NBC Game of the Week religiously, from the 1970s through the late 80s. They had a host of great baseball play-by-play men and color commentators, which included the likes of Curt Gowdy, Tony Kubek, Joe Garagiola, Dick Enberg, and, later, Vin Scully. That's how I came to know and love Riverfront Stadium, as well as many of the other classic baseball parks. Alas, baseball has since died for me.

spartachris
09-21-2009, 10:04 AM
Works perfectly! Thank you so much for this fix. I can't believe how fast you got that done. Bravo!!

Peace,
Christopher Hall