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majordude
03-16-2007, 10:50 PM
Are there any translations that utilize the same original scripts as the KJV? I love KJV but find it hard at times. But I don't want a "heretical" version like NIV, NLT or something like that.

Adelphos
03-17-2007, 12:06 AM
Are there any translations that utilize the same original scripts as the KJV? I love KJV but find it hard at times. But I don't want a "heretical" version like NIV, NLT or something like that.

As far as modern translations are concerned, the NKJV, which is included in BW, is probably the closest to what you are looking for. The NKJV is based primarily on the Textus Receptus, which is the same Greek Text that underlies the Reformation Bibles, including the KJV, although there are a number of places in the NKJV where it departs from the Textus Receptus and follows the NA/UBS Greek text.

The NKJV also abandons the second person singular/plural distinctions in both the OT and the NT, distinctions which are uniformly preserved in the KJV.

majordude
03-18-2007, 06:00 PM
Wow. I think I have to learn how to read the KJV! I like it the best (when I can understand it)!

I'll look at the NKJV but those anomalies you mentioned are probably enough to keep me from adopting it as my version of choice.

SCSaunders
03-19-2007, 12:37 PM
But I don't want a "heretical" version like NIV, NLT or something like that.Just curious. I've heard arguments calling the NIV into question, but I'm interested in hearing yours regarding the NLT? What's your basis?

I thought maybe I'd found one. Someone mentioned in church this past Sunday that John 1:1 was evidence of a heretical translation. I'll admit, my old eyes just don't see it. No indefinite article. No lower case "g".


NLT John 1:1 In the beginning the Word already existed. The Word was with God, and the Word was God.

majordude
03-20-2007, 08:40 PM
How is NLT heretical?

Deuteronomy - "sodomite" changed to "temple prostitute"
1 Kings 14:24 - "sodomites" replaced with "shrine prostitutes"
1 Kings 15:12 - "sodomites" replaced with "shrine prostitutes"
1 Kings 22:46 - "sodomites" replaced with "shrine prostitutes"
2 Kings 23:7 - "sodomites" replaced with "shrine prostitutes"
Matthew 17:21 - entire verse omitted
Matthew 18:11 - entire verse omitted
Matthew 19:9 - half of the verse is omitted
Matthew 23:14 - entire verse omitted
Mark 6:11 - half of the verse is omitted
Mark 7:16 - entire verse omitted
Mark 9:44, 46 - entire verses omitted
Mark 11:26 - entire verse omitted
Mark 15:28 - entire verse omitted
Mark 16:9-20 - entire passage is questioned by a footnote that says, "The most reliable early manuscripts conclude the Gospel of Mark at verse 8"
Luke 4:8 - "get thee behind me Satan" is omitted
Luke 17:36 - entire verse omitted
Luke 23:17 - entire verse omitted
John 1:10 - says God created everything "through" Jesus instead of "by" Jesus as the KJB teaches
John 1:41 - The NLT leaves out the phrase, "Which is by interpretation, a stone." Hence, the critical distinction between Peter as "the stone" (Petros), and Jesus as "The Rock" (Petra) is obscured. This was no doubt deliberate to pleases Catholics who falsely teach that Peter is the rock upon which the church is built. The Bible states in no uncertain terms, "For other foundation can no man lay than that is laid, which is Jesus Christ" (1st Corinthians 3:11).
John 3:16 - the all important word "begotten" is omitted, thus denying the deity of Christ
John 3:13 - "which is in heaven" is omitted John 5:4 - entire verse omitted
John 7:53 - 8:11 -- entire passage is questioned in a note which says, "The most ancient Greek manuscripts do not include John 7:53 - 8:11"
Acts 8:37 - entire verse omitted
Acts 12:4 - changes "Easter" to the incorrect "Passover" (See Numbers 28:16,17 and Acts 12:2 in the KJB)
Acts 17:29 - completely removes the "Godhead"
Acts 28:29 - entire verse omitted
Romans 1:20 - completely removes the "Godhead"
Romans 16:24 - entire verse omitted
Philippians 2:6 -removes the word "equal," thus denying Christ's deity
Colossians 1:16 - says God created everything "through" Jesus instead of "by" Jesus as the KJB teaches
Colossians 2:9 - completely removes the "Godhead"
1 Timothy 3:16 - "God" is omitted, says "Christ appeared in the flesh, thus denying the deity of Christ
1 Timothy 6:5 - "from such withdraw thyself" is omitted
Hebrews 1:3 - the all-important words "by himself" are omitted
1 Peter 4:1 - "for us" is omitted
1 Peter 4:14 - half of the verse is omitted
1 John 3:16 -completely removes "the love of God"
1 John 4:3 - the all-important words "Christ is come in the flesh" are omitted 1 John 5:7-8 -- Trinitarian clause omitted
1 John 5:7 - half of the verse is omitted, thus denying the Godhead
1 John 5:13 - half of the verse is omitted
Revelation 1:11 - first half of the verse is omitted
Revelation 5:14 - "him that liveth forever and ever" is omittedMore... (http://www.jesus-is-savior.com/Bible/NLT/nlt_exposed.htm)

Michael Hanel
03-20-2007, 08:55 PM
I hesitate to even reply to this because this doesn't really belong in this forum. I'm not defending the translation of the NLT, but it is appropriate to at least properly characterize your arguments. Many of the issues you raise concerning the NLT is not so much a matter of the NLT writers being heretical as it is the fact that the NLT and KJV are translated from a very different Greek text, i.e. the Majority Text vs. the Nestle-Aland tradition. Thus for instance many of those parts where "whole parts" are missing or verses are dropped is not so much because the NLT people just felt like throwing things out but because they were translating from the text in the Nestle-Aland.

That having been said there are still things not to like about the NLT, if that's your position. One can put it quite concisely, and neutrally, to say that the KJV translation and NLT translation are based on very different translation techniques.

SCSaunders
03-21-2007, 06:54 AM
I'm not defending the translation of the NLT, but it is appropriate to at least properly characterize your arguments. That's what I was seeking to understand.

I've heard and read the arguments against the NIV. Folks of no small stature have taken it to task. I still use it. Gave my kids NIVs.

In the same way, I was curious about claims against the NLV. Text-based? Dynamic Equivalence? Theological bent? A new wind blowing through Mars Hill? What exactly? Just curious.

I wasn't going to respond originally. If it talks like a Troll. But when several days later I heard a similar claim, well ... thought I would find out what three questions got raised.

Glenn Weaver
03-21-2007, 03:55 PM
This forum is for questions about how to use BibleWorks. It is not for broader discussions such as are being discussed. Please move this discussion elsewhere.

SCSaunders
03-22-2007, 01:05 PM
This forum is for questions about how to use BibleWorks. It is not for broader discussions such as are being discussed. Please move this discussion elsewhere.10-4 Glenn!

I'm on a new quest anyway. My daughters asked me last night, "Daddy, why does Sanjaya sort of look like a girl?" So, first order of business, "What's a 'Sanjaya'?"

MajorDude, whatever differing translations we use on our BW7 platforms, Christ has thrown us together as brothers. My apologies if I offended you.

majordude
03-24-2007, 07:10 PM
Offended? No way, brother!

:)

Scribe Thoth
03-29-2007, 10:20 PM
Errata: Life is Like, after The Few Exceptions... Insert The Translations differ in terms of loss of word meaning as inJames 2:3 to him that weareth the gay clothing, and say unto him, Sit thou here in a good place, the translators understanding of the meanings of certain words.

Scribe Thoth
03-29-2007, 10:24 PM
My Beloved Brethren,
To say this is not an issue of consequence is consequential. It is not always an issue of the text, but the text does play a large part in the translation of a text. If you have the new version of Bible Works (And you Should) You can click on the Set Text Compare Button and list the versions of both the Translated and Original Language Text Differences to see how the text affected the differences of a translation. By and Large, Brethren, you will find the differences are more in Word Order, Article Presence, Verb Tense, or Morphological Feature in the Original Language. The Few Exceptions are listed in Textual Commentary of the Greek New Testament (Also found in Bible Works).
I am a Textual Critic and have read both the Earliest Manuscripts of the New Testament (Also found in Bible Works as an Add On), the Major Texts for Textual Families [ KJO persons will come to great surprise when they read Codex Bezea--Their Family Patronage], and have seen that much of the debate is Theologians wanting to sound more intellectual or spiritual than they really are in truth. If your hope lies in the first Translation of the Bible than read the Geneva Translation (Found in Bible Works)--not the KJV! If your hope lies in more modern times go to the Original Language Texts which Bible Works offers life no other in Terms of Bible Software, IE Logos, Quick Verse, Thompson-Chain, E-Sword, Etc.
My hope is that you not loose yourselves in debate over foolish things1 Timothy 1:4 Neither give heed to fables and endless genealogies, which minister questions, rather than godly edifying which is in faith: so do. But that you give yourself to the Greater things in the Word of GodMatthew 23:23 the weightier matters of the law, judgment, mercy, and faith: these ought ye to have done
May God Lead you into all Truth by His Spirit